Man Of Steel (2013)

Drew

00:00:03.040 - 00:00:04.148

Movie wars.

Seth

00:00:11.520 - 00:00:12.552

Just start.

Speaker C

00:00:12.736 - 00:00:16.460

Ladies and gentlemen, Drew has got something stuck in his crawl.

Drew

00:00:18.800 - 00:00:25.992

That's why you guys replaced me with Marian. Intros like that where I tried to drink all my coffee beforehand.

Speaker C

00:00:26.056 - 00:00:39.924

We were gonna intro the show, and Drew had never heard the phrase get stuck in my craw. It's old phrase if you haven't heard it. And then we. We start the podcast, and something got stuck in his throat. Craw.

And whatever a craw is, it can go anywhere.

Drew

00:00:39.972 - 00:00:47.956

Yeah. I think the reason that's an old phrase is because it's so weird.

And people, we evolved as a society, and we're like, let's not say weird stuff like that.

Speaker C

00:00:48.028 - 00:00:55.428

It sounds both strangely innocent and strangely crass at the same time. It's like, this sounds like it was in the 20s, but it also sounds like this could be a horrible thing.

Drew

00:00:55.484 - 00:00:58.468

It also sounds like it's like in the next, like, rap music video.

Seth

00:00:58.524 - 00:00:59.684

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker C

00:00:59.732 - 00:01:07.360

Lil Craw stuck in cr. May. I hope somebody gives us credit for that, because there will be a little crawl. Now you watch.

Drew

00:01:07.400 - 00:01:11.264

Perfect. Yeah. And it started here on the Movie wars podcast.

Speaker C

00:01:11.312 - 00:01:14.384

I actually did research. 75% of our audience are mumble rappers.

Seth

00:01:14.432 - 00:01:14.976

There we go.

Drew

00:01:15.048 - 00:01:15.344

Perfect.

Seth

00:01:15.392 - 00:01:15.904

That's helpful.

Drew

00:01:15.952 - 00:01:17.140

That's our demographic.

Speaker C

00:01:17.880 - 00:01:35.936

Well, you know. You know, Seth has gotten on my good side when we are voluntarily covering hero movies outside of Batman, because that's the only one I care about.

But James Gunn just released his a trailer for the new Superman, and it got. It got. It was very. It was viral right off the bat.

Seth

00:01:35.968 - 00:01:36.720

Oh, yeah.

Speaker C

00:01:36.880 - 00:01:47.140

I. I know Matthew Blevins wouldn't mind me quoting him, but Matthew Blevins said the funniest thing about this. He said.

I sent it to him and said, what do you think about this? He says, it looks like a Sprint ad from the mid aughts.

Seth

00:01:49.240 - 00:01:50.256

He's not wrong.

Speaker C

00:01:50.368 - 00:01:54.864

I've texted him twice since then saying I randomly thought about that text and laughed.

Drew

00:01:54.912 - 00:01:55.168

Right.

Speaker C

00:01:55.224 - 00:02:09.508

Just out of nowhere. Like, I was on the phone at work and I thought about Sprint ad from the mid aughts and just started laughing. And he is not wrong. Like, you said it.

We're not here to talk about it, but that's why we're doing it. But the trail looks horrible. It looks like dog shit looks so bad.

Drew

00:02:09.564 - 00:02:11.700

Well, the dog is the best part of it.

Speaker C

00:02:11.740 - 00:02:16.196

Yeah. And people have been memeing the shit out of that dog.

Drew

00:02:16.388 - 00:02:17.796

It's like, Super Lassie.

Seth

00:02:17.908 - 00:02:33.984

Oh, my God. Yeah, I. I understand why everyone's like, it's Kane and he's Been in the comics since the 50s. He's been.

He's had 13 appearances across comics and cartoons since the 1950s. I don't know why we're putting him in this movie. It just feels so weird.

Drew

00:02:34.032 - 00:02:45.520

It's like Homeward Bound, but with Superman. I'm cool with it. No, to me, the trailer. The trailer was just so generic. Like, at the end of it, I was like, okay, so that's. That's a movie.

Speaker C

00:02:45.600 - 00:02:50.112

Yeah. Well, and Superman is kind of a generic hero because of, you know, he's one of the oldest and.

Drew

00:02:50.136 - 00:02:50.336

Yeah.

Seth

00:02:50.368 - 00:02:50.672

Yeah.

Speaker C

00:02:50.736 - 00:02:59.624

You know, he's kind of a generic superhero. He wears red, red and blue, and it's like, yeah. But every deviation lately has been, how can we make him not generic?

Drew

00:02:59.672 - 00:03:14.440

Oh, my gosh. So I. Because after watching it, the trailer, I remember thinking, like, well, I wonder if they're gonna do anything different. That seems so generic.

And then in rewatching man of Steel and Batman versus Superman, I was like, oh, okay. So maybe a little generic would. Would help.

Speaker C

00:03:14.480 - 00:03:14.872

Yeah.

Drew

00:03:14.936 - 00:03:15.540

Here.

Seth

00:03:16.160 - 00:03:19.208

Okay. Are you about to get in the history? Because I have some shit to say about the.

Speaker C

00:03:19.264 - 00:03:29.544

Yeah, I'll kick us off. Yeah, we were. We were actually gonna start a new franchise in February. I think we were looking at. We were looking at a bunch.

And then Seth texted me, is like, hey, did you see the new trailer? He's like, we should do the Snyder trilogy.

Seth

00:03:29.592 - 00:03:29.864

Yeah.

Speaker C

00:03:29.912 - 00:03:42.152

Because it was timely, and we're trying to get more timely here. Usually I, I. My. I'm. I'm a contrarian. So someone's like, hey, we should do something about this movie. Because this thing's out.

It's like, let's go to the 1940s and find some unknown movie.

Seth

00:03:42.216 - 00:03:44.216

Let's go watch the racist Batman series.

Speaker C

00:03:44.288 - 00:04:00.862

Yes. Let's do that instead. Let's be the antithesis of what's in culture.

But I have wanted to kind of get into it because, I mean, not just because of the Superman trailer, but the Snyder stuff. It's funny because I don't keep up with the culture of movies. I just care about the movies. I don't care about celebrities. I obsess over the movies.

Seth

00:04:00.926 - 00:04:01.310

Yeah.

Speaker C

00:04:01.390 - 00:04:10.718

I typically miss out on this stuff, and I find out about it much later. Like, when the Snyder trilogy came out, I started seeing all these comments and stuff. I was like, why is everybody so upset about this?

Seth

00:04:10.774 - 00:04:11.102

Yeah.

Speaker C

00:04:11.166 - 00:04:11.902

You know, and so.

Seth

00:04:11.926 - 00:04:20.096

And then I go, when man of Steel came out, people were actually, for the most part, obviously, you had the dissenters. But at the time, Man Of Steel was considered to be an incredible.

Drew

00:04:20.198 - 00:04:25.320

You sound like you're, like you run a country. Obviously we have the centers. We don't talk about that.

Seth

00:04:25.620 - 00:04:27.692

I am the king of Snyderville.

Drew

00:04:27.756 - 00:04:30.252

We just let the military take care of those people.

Speaker C

00:04:30.436 - 00:04:30.988

Yeah.

Seth

00:04:31.084 - 00:04:32.764

The Earl of Snyder done.

Drew

00:04:32.932 - 00:04:45.436

I do. I remember seeing man of Steel in theaters and absolutely loving it.

And, and actually really enjoying because the big part was the controversial ending. That's where the dissenter. Yeah. And.

Seth

00:04:45.588 - 00:04:49.436

Well, that and the color correction and the tone of it, which I'll get into it as I keep going.

Drew

00:04:49.508 - 00:04:53.728

But I remember for that movie, really liking that that was the end.

Seth

00:04:53.784 - 00:04:54.400

Yeah.

Drew

00:04:54.560 - 00:05:09.280

And I'll be. But I'll be honest, in my, in our rewatching of it, I, I think I'm.

I, I think I let the whole love for superhero movies my first roll around get me more with man of Steel because when I watched it this time, I still liked it.

Seth

00:05:09.320 - 00:05:09.616

Yeah.

Drew

00:05:09.648 - 00:05:21.708

But there are some things that I. And then, then going it then I was a lot more aware with them. When we get into our next episode, we talk about Batman versus Superman.

But man of Steel, if it was just by itself, it holds up.

Seth

00:05:21.764 - 00:05:23.292

It's. It's a very solid movie.

Speaker C

00:05:23.356 - 00:05:23.884

Yeah.

Seth

00:05:24.012 - 00:06:14.522

Here's the thing. You have to remember the time period. It came out the year before.

We had just wrapped up the Dark Knight trilogy with the Dark Knight Rises and the first Avengers movie had come out both in the same year or literally within months of each other.

At the time, people, when they, when they saw they were going to do a Superman movie, literally everybody online was like, oh, wouldn't it be awesome if we had like a Christopher Nolan type Superman movie? Like, that is literally what people were begging for.

And so when he signed on to produce, executive produce, and then Zack Snyder came on to direct it, people were excited because they thought they were going to get something different from Marvel and something a little more in the grounded tone of the Dark Knight trilogy.

So, I mean, that's kind of where this whole thing started was people hoping that the Superman series was going to have a very similar tone to the Dark Knight.

Drew

00:06:14.626 - 00:06:23.750

And it's interesting when I think about, like the Snyderverse, because I feel like, I don't know, maybe. Maybe one day you'll. Seth, you can teach. I don't know if you teach this. I don't know. I don't know.

Seth

00:06:24.210 - 00:06:25.950

I teach this at community college.

Drew

00:06:26.370 - 00:06:34.762

I think someone should teach a unit of film of a film class and entitle it. What went wrong with the Snyderverse?

Seth

00:06:34.826 - 00:06:36.586

I can tell you exactly what went wrong with this?

Drew

00:06:36.658 - 00:06:41.198

Because I think there's a lot of good things about the movies that. That we saw from it.

Seth

00:06:41.254 - 00:06:41.822

Yeah.

Drew

00:06:41.966 - 00:06:50.798

But I think there's a lot of things that it. Like, it makes sense now in the future to be like, oh, that's why the movies ended up not finishing.

Seth

00:06:50.894 - 00:06:51.166

Yeah.

Drew

00:06:51.198 - 00:07:05.582

Before they. But for me, I think the biggest problem was, and you said it yourself, like, right from the minute they started man of Steel, it was leading.

There was always like, we're going to make our version of the Avengers.

Seth

00:07:05.646 - 00:07:05.886

Yeah.

Drew

00:07:05.918 - 00:07:20.760

And so there was always this long, drawn out chronicle of movies we're gonna make. And somehow in thinking of the big picture, they forgot the kind of important thing, in my opinion, which is each movie needs to be good.

Seth

00:07:20.880 - 00:07:21.352

Sure.

Drew

00:07:21.456 - 00:07:31.832

And now I know if we were to look at Marvel nowadays, we could say that they've also forgotten that. But before the first Avengers, every single Marvel movie stood by itself.

Seth

00:07:31.896 - 00:07:32.526

Yeah.

Drew

00:07:32.688 - 00:07:42.630

And then the first Avengers maybe capitalized on that. But it. And I still think man of Steel may, at the most, maybe that one could stand by itself.

Speaker C

00:07:43.210 - 00:07:43.714

Right.

Drew

00:07:43.802 - 00:07:48.290

But I mean. Well, we'll get into the next movie in the next episode. I don't want to.

Seth

00:07:48.330 - 00:09:22.800

Here's. Here's the thing. Just to give a little overview of the movies we're about to go over. We're not going to go through the entire dceu.

We're not going to go over Wonder Woman or Aquaman or Suicide Squad or any of those other movies. We just wanted to focus on these.

But when you look at the broader picture of what Warner Brothers and DC did with the dceu, I've actually looked at the box office numbers, and every movie that Zack Snyder had a direct hand in working on killed at the box office. Man of Steel, I think, was above half. Half a billion dollars at the box office. I think it was 800 BVs made even more legitimately.

Wonder Woman made a shit ton of money. Uh, then you had Justice League, which still did well in the box office, but was nowhere near as well received.

And then that's when things started to go downhill because you saw Zack Snyder have to check out. He had a child who committed suicide, and so he had to leave the franchise at the time.

And Warner Brothers started nitpicking every single thing that every director did because Batman vs Superman was so divisive. I can't personally say it was not well received because there is an entire half of the fan base that raves, especially over the Ultimate Edition.

But overall, kind of like the Last Jedi, it Very much split the entire fandom as far as people who loved it and people who hated it. And there really isn't much middle ground.

But once you see Warner Brothers really getting their fingers in the tone of the universe, which mostly started with Suicide Squad Squad, that's when you really see the box office numbers continuously go down.

Speaker C

00:09:22.920 - 00:10:18.176

Yeah, yeah. There's this. They're almost. I don't know if they knew they were doing this at the time when they decided to do this.

Obviously, we're focused on man of Steel today, but we're also introducing this whole franchise. They're recovering, but, you know, they really stepped in it without, I think, knowing, because not only.

So you have what you just talked about with the background of the film that was divisive, and then never has it because of the Internet. Never has canonization also been. Oh, yeah, such a hot topic. So they're. They're purposely stumbling into this.

Like, not only the stuff you talked about with the background, but, like, then you have the comic book warriors. And again, I don't have a problem with them, but I just disclaimer, I love Batman, but that's the only superhero I care about.

I am disregarding the comics for this. Not. Not that I'm saying it's not important, but, yeah, I will be approaching this as a film.

So before you at me about the canon, there are dozens of different comic book storylines that are out there.

Seth

00:10:18.248 - 00:10:19.488

So many different iterations.

Speaker C

00:10:19.584 - 00:10:19.904

Yes.

Seth

00:10:19.952 - 00:10:20.320

Yeah.

Speaker C

00:10:20.400 - 00:10:26.480

So I'm looking at this as a movie, you know, a little more. I think you probably know more about the comics. I don't know about.

Seth

00:10:26.600 - 00:10:41.188

I know very little about any. Any comics. I wasn't really into them growing up. I do enjoy superhero movies, but for me, because each comic storyline is its own thing.

Why can't the movies be their own thing? We should treat the movies as their own version of the story.

Drew

00:10:41.304 - 00:11:06.060

I think there's nothing wrong with looking at great comics and appreciating the great comic, but then looking at the movie adaptation of it and be like, it missed its mark. I mean, in other things, we do that with books all the time. We do that with. I mean, even. Even movie. We.

We've done it here with movie reboots, you know, when, like, it's just. It's hard to take something that people love so much.

Speaker C

00:11:06.180 - 00:11:06.572

Yeah.

Drew

00:11:06.636 - 00:11:41.114

And I mean, I don't. I just think it's unfair to that thing to give the same kind of reverence to a movie based off of it. Like, I mean, because I think.

I think that's the part of the challenge for the director is.

And not just the director, but everyone in the filmmaking process, even from the actors who are playing the individual characters, is you want to do something in a way where it pays homage or does well for the original comic version. But then there's also the whole creativity part of it, where you want to add your own creative liberty to this. And Zack.

Zack Snyder did a lot of creative liberties with this whole series, but remember.

Seth

00:11:41.162 - 00:11:45.226

He is also trying to build on people who may not be into the comics.

Drew

00:11:45.258 - 00:11:45.562

Yes.

Seth

00:11:45.626 - 00:11:46.794

Trying to get them into the.

Drew

00:11:46.882 - 00:12:07.738

Which is fair. And so. And I. But I almost. When it's done well, or at least when it's the way that I. I enjoy. I like it when you.

You know, if a movie is adapting something else and then it takes its own creative liberties, it makes it kind of more fun, like a little. Like a little twist. It's like, I really like cover songs as long as they're good and have, like, a good electric guitar solo at some point.

Seth

00:12:07.794 - 00:12:13.158

Yeah. Yeah. But I mean. Yeah, sometimes the. The COVID of a song is what becomes more famous.

Drew

00:12:13.254 - 00:12:16.230

Yeah. So, like, Hurt by Johnny Cash is.

Seth

00:12:16.270 - 00:12:19.558

A Nine Inch Nails cover, and everyone knows the Johnny Cash version.

Speaker C

00:12:19.654 - 00:12:20.390

Yep.

Drew

00:12:20.550 - 00:12:22.742

Literally every hymn in the Protestant.

Seth

00:12:22.806 - 00:12:23.462

Yeah.

Drew

00:12:23.606 - 00:12:26.210

Because it started off as a drinking song at a bar.

Seth

00:12:26.830 - 00:12:27.690

Yep.

Speaker C

00:12:28.510 - 00:12:28.886

Yeah.

Drew

00:12:28.918 - 00:12:34.214

In case anyone is. In case anyone listens to the Movie wars podcast for church history trivia. There you go.

Speaker C

00:12:34.302 - 00:12:36.650

Yeah. Wasn't one of the greatest hymn writers blind?

Seth

00:12:37.210 - 00:12:37.858

I'm sure.

Speaker C

00:12:37.914 - 00:12:42.770

Yeah. That's what he was doing. He's ripping off drunkards. They didn't even know he's blind. They wouldn't accuse him.

Seth

00:12:42.810 - 00:12:44.610

He was the first Weird Al Yankovic.

Speaker C

00:12:44.690 - 00:12:51.090

Yeah. Surely the blind guy wasn't ripping off our drinking songs for the church, was he? That's a movie in and of itself.

Seth

00:12:51.170 - 00:12:53.746

I thought I was just at a restaurant. I didn't know it was at a bar.

Speaker C

00:12:53.818 - 00:12:54.786

That's your next movie, dude.

Seth

00:12:54.818 - 00:12:55.026

Yeah.

Speaker C

00:12:55.058 - 00:12:57.090

That's hilarious. That's a hilarious idea, actually.

Seth

00:12:57.130 - 00:12:57.570

There we go.

Speaker C

00:12:57.610 - 00:13:18.842

Some, like, medieval. Yeah. So let's get into our experiences. You know, I'll kick off because, you know, I.

I really like Batman a lot, and I've read some of the comics, but outside of that, you know, mcu. I'm just gonna be honest. It doesn't get me excited, and I don't hate that other people hate it. There's just so much of it out in the world.

There's just so many. And every time I see they're making another property, I'm like, it's over.

Seth

00:13:18.946 - 00:13:19.370

Yeah.

Speaker C

00:13:19.450 - 00:13:21.722

It's like, it was good when it was good, you know, and.

Seth

00:13:21.746 - 00:13:22.218

Yeah.

Speaker C

00:13:22.314 - 00:13:56.384

So, you know, my thing with Superman is I in these movies.

We'll get into it more later, but these movies actually confuse me even worse because my biggest problem with Superman is knowing what his limitations are. And we. You say kryptonite. That's like the obvious one. But it's like, when does his punch hurt the most?

You know, it's like, because he's invincible in a lot of ways. I never, in these movies, like, every Superman movie I've seen, like. Well, I don't really know what his limitations are.

Batman's very easy because he's a man, you know, he's not an alien. He's a man with gadgets.

Drew

00:13:56.432 - 00:13:56.752

Yeah.

Speaker C

00:13:56.816 - 00:14:01.818

And so it's easier to kind of, you know, demarcate where. Where he is not supernatural.

Drew

00:14:01.914 - 00:14:02.234

Yeah.

Speaker C

00:14:02.282 - 00:14:03.034

But with Superman.

Drew

00:14:03.082 - 00:14:07.882

Except he's got the supernatural plot armor. Like, when you're watching him in the next movie.

Seth

00:14:07.946 - 00:14:11.230

I mean, it was literal armor, but we'll get to that next movie.

Drew

00:14:11.650 - 00:14:22.714

That's true in every alliteration of Batman because that's the biggest thing to be. Like, he doesn't have any superpowers. I was like, he has the writers section of the room. That's the superpower. Is they. He can money.

Speaker C

00:14:22.802 - 00:14:32.902

Yeah. But when. When they start getting in the fights, especially towards the end of man of Steel, like in.

And they're destroying the, you know, 2 trillion doll worth of property damage, which.

Seth

00:14:32.926 - 00:14:41.142

I will say, in preparation for this, even before we fully decided I knew we were going to do it eventually, I went through for the first time the entire animated series of Superman.

Drew

00:14:41.206 - 00:14:42.166

Oh, good for you.

Seth

00:14:42.238 - 00:14:49.382

Same shit, dude. They destroying the city left and right, and then suddenly next episode, it's all back together. So, I mean, this is kind of standard for Superman.

Drew

00:14:49.446 - 00:14:54.406

You know, if you're a. If you're a construction worker, if you're an architect, Metropolis is the place to move.

Seth

00:14:54.478 - 00:14:55.290

Literally.

Drew

00:14:55.870 - 00:14:57.478

You will always have work.

Seth

00:14:57.534 - 00:14:57.814

Yes.

Speaker C

00:14:57.862 - 00:15:02.538

Then why wasn't the song Break Stuff by Limp Bizkit? It should have been on the soundtrack.

Drew

00:15:02.614 - 00:15:05.042

Think every movie everywhere should have a Limp Bizkit song.

Speaker C

00:15:05.106 - 00:15:06.710

Absolutely. Big fan.

Drew

00:15:07.210 - 00:15:10.210

But that's the reel that will make everyone hate this podcast.

Speaker C

00:15:10.370 - 00:15:11.074

Yeah.

Seth

00:15:11.202 - 00:15:12.754

No, it should have the Deftones.

Speaker C

00:15:12.802 - 00:15:16.162

The Deftones. The Limp Biscuits. The. The Limp Biscuits.

Seth

00:15:16.226 - 00:15:17.350

Limp. The Biscuits.

Drew

00:15:17.930 - 00:15:19.670

Limp Biscuits and Gravy.

Speaker C

00:15:20.090 - 00:15:28.194

So when I. I actually saw this pretty close to the time it came out, and I, I, I'll be honest, I just kind of went into it negatively.

Just because I don't like Superman.

Seth

00:15:28.242 - 00:15:28.582

Fair.

Speaker C

00:15:28.666 - 00:15:46.654

I was excited when I heard Seasons by Chris Cornell on the soundtrack. That's one of my favorite songs of all time. That was kind of cool. But, you know, by and large, like, I like Henry Cavill. I like what he does here. I.

I like the things they're aiming at. I do like this dark approach. Obviously, though, it was like, well, Nolan's involved, Goyer's involved. It's like. But this isn't a Nolan movie.

Seth

00:15:46.702 - 00:15:47.022

Yeah.

Drew

00:15:47.086 - 00:15:47.310

Right.

Speaker C

00:15:47.350 - 00:15:53.630

And it's always been weird for me to see him. His name on it and his involvement, but it's like, he has such a high standard.

Seth

00:15:53.710 - 00:15:54.116

Yeah.

Speaker C

00:15:54.198 - 00:16:02.280

And it's like. Like, was this okay with him? Like, did he just kind of inspire him to do this stuff? So that was always a big point of contention for me.

It's like, well, I know it's not a.

Seth

00:16:02.320 - 00:16:03.704

And he loves these movies.

Speaker C

00:16:03.752 - 00:16:04.168

He does.

Seth

00:16:04.224 - 00:16:21.842

He literally. Every time he's talked about Zack Snyder in these movies, he's been very, like, very full of praise. He. He and Zack Snyder are very close friends.

Actually, when Justice League came out, which we are covering, he literally told Zack, do not go see this movie. You will be. You will be crushed by what they did to your baby.

Speaker C

00:16:21.906 - 00:16:22.194

Wow.

Seth

00:16:22.242 - 00:16:22.466

Yeah.

Drew

00:16:22.498 - 00:16:23.122

That's interesting.

Seth

00:16:23.186 - 00:16:23.522

Yeah.

Drew

00:16:23.586 - 00:16:33.074

I wonder if that. This. This might be cynical, but does he love those movies?

Because he loves Zack Snyder and he's a good friend and just in the way I would support either of you.

Seth

00:16:33.162 - 00:16:34.194

Or, like, he also.

Drew

00:16:34.282 - 00:16:38.562

Is it because he's a good movie director and he looks at these like, this is a good work of art.

Seth

00:16:38.666 - 00:16:42.510

Fast and the Furious is his favorite series. So, I mean, take that as you will.

Drew

00:16:43.450 - 00:16:49.940

You know, Liz does claim Tokyo Drift is the best. That's. We talk. We talk about that at the Quarter Mile podcast.

Speaker C

00:16:50.280 - 00:16:55.536

It's kind of like how, you know, there you read stories about Michelin star chefs that love McDonald's.

Seth

00:16:55.568 - 00:16:56.064

Yeah.

Speaker C

00:16:56.192 - 00:17:06.240

I'm not saying that it's that disparate. Like, I know that sounds like I'm shitting on this movie a lot, but when you compare this to a Nolan, like, there's. It's not the same level of like.

Like the standard.

Seth

00:17:06.320 - 00:17:11.614

I mean, I. I genuinely think man of Steel could easily fit in the Nolan universe.

Speaker C

00:17:11.672 - 00:17:11.890

Really?

Seth

00:17:11.930 - 00:17:19.922

I absolutely do. So I see. This is where I know you two are going to start ganging up on me. I'm going to disagree.

Speaker C

00:17:19.986 - 00:17:28.178

I'm going to use your Nolan love against you. Now, granted, you. You've been spared for the Most part you haven't. You haven't been. You haven't been the ire.

We've been pretty positive for the most part.

Seth

00:17:28.234 - 00:17:29.202

Yeah, yeah.

Drew

00:17:29.266 - 00:18:03.488

But I try to get, I try to keep it positive. I also try to give space when I respectfully disagree.

Only in that I think this, now this would movie would fit in the actual universe with, you know, Batman from Nolan, Nolan verse and the color scheme and that version of Metropolis. Absolutely. But like, if we were.

I feel like if it was in the same universe and we were comparing the overall plots of the Dark Knight trilogy versus even just the man is still, we'd be like, oh, this one, this one kind of fell short.

Speaker C

00:18:03.634 - 00:18:04.100

Yeah.

Seth

00:18:04.180 - 00:18:06.680

What do you mean by we, Kemo Sabi? Whoa.

Drew

00:18:07.020 - 00:18:09.316

We the general public of people.

Seth

00:18:09.468 - 00:18:54.280

See, that's the thing is again, especially when man of Steel came out, the vast majority of people were totally on board with it. And I personally don't really see any issues story wise. So feel free to tell me your grievances.

But especially just concerning man of Steel, like, I think it is everything it needed to be to bring in a new version of Superman.

Because when you look at the five Superman movies we had before this, we had the four Christopher Reeves movies and then we had Superman Returns with Brandon Ralph and having for the first time very recently seen the first Superman movie and Superman Returns, I don't like the tone that they take because there is nothing for me to give a about Superman.

Drew

00:18:54.360 - 00:18:54.600

Right.

Seth

00:18:54.640 - 00:19:06.858

I don't care about Clark Kent. I don't care about Superman because there is no emotion behind that character. He's just the, oh, I'm gonna beat everyone and I'm cool. Here we go.

I'll reverse time by turning the world backwards.

Drew

00:19:06.954 - 00:19:08.234

That was so stupid.

Seth

00:19:08.362 - 00:19:26.602

And it's in the first movie. That's the one. Everyone's like, this is the greatest Superman movie ever. I'm like, they're horrible.

As far as, like, there's a lot of good I could pull out of both them and the Brandon Routh versions. But overall the tone of them I just don't think made me care about the person the movie is named after.

Drew

00:19:26.706 - 00:19:29.242

TV and animated Superman's where it's at. That's all.

Seth

00:19:29.266 - 00:20:23.666

I. I haven't seen any of the live action TV shows, but I've heard great things about them.

But as far as the Animated series go, I think they make Brandon Routh's and Christopher Reeve's version look terrible.

Now this, on the other hand, the reason I like it so much is because at least for the First, I don't know, hour and 45 minutes of the movie, you are focused on Clark's struggle with trying to figure out how to be a human, but also who's an alien. He's trying to figure out his place in this crazy world where he knows the moment people know what he can do, he's gonna get looked at strange.

So I, I think this is the first time we've really seen in film form.

I'm not going to include TV in this, in this statement, but in film form that we've actually seen the, the character of Clark Kent really struggle with the emotions of being a person that has all these powers.

Drew

00:20:23.698 - 00:20:30.226

Yeah, I don't. I, I like 80% agree. Okay, I, I'll, I'll, I'll.

Seth

00:20:30.418 - 00:20:38.530

And like I said, film only not including tv because I know, I know big. Because I've been told that the live action shows really do capture that struggle.

Drew

00:20:38.610 - 00:20:41.186

But of course, they have more space to.

Seth

00:20:41.258 - 00:20:42.034

Yeah, exactly.

Drew

00:20:42.082 - 00:21:10.108

Build the character. And here, here was the thing that was. Here were the couple things that were interesting to me about man of Steel as it pertains to Superman.

First of all, right from the very beginning, Snyder's very clear that this is going to be a different version of Superman than we've seen. Even in the flashback sequence when they say this was the most useless and weird thing to me, but it added to the characters.

This is the first natural born child that is authentically Snyder thing.

Seth

00:21:10.164 - 00:21:11.020

Oh, 100%.

Drew

00:21:11.140 - 00:21:17.314

And it also, later in the movie and for the rest of the series, has no use whatsoever.

Seth

00:21:17.442 - 00:21:21.030

Oh, I disagree with that. But that was the reason he could absorb the codex.

Drew

00:21:21.930 - 00:22:31.312

Okay, okay, that makes sense. But okay, so right from the bat, when we are seeing Clark, we're seeing a more human version of Superman in that this.

I mean, at the end, of course, the big ones, when he has to make the choice to kill in every other version of Superman, he always finds a way to save the day and not kill at the same time. Right at the beginning, when he's coming back from the Arctic at one point, he steals people's clothing. Superman doesn't steal. This version does.

And it's kind of letting you know that this is a flawed hero, which is like, what they. What? And actually with all the heroes, they eventually, they kind of show.

And then there's the scene, of course, when, you know, he's struggling with his anger that the guy at the bar who pours the drink on him and he could punch him out, but he doesn't, but he still goes and impales the truck on the thing. And that's the movie's way of showing you, okay, he didn't kill him, but he does have a bit of a temper, and he did.

Whereas any other version of Superman would have figured out a way to fix the issue with his words and make a lesson out of it.

Seth

00:22:31.416 - 00:22:34.976

You know, citizen, you really shouldn't be consuming this much alcohol.

Drew

00:22:35.168 - 00:22:41.594

So. But. So they frequently have humanized in this movie his alien ness.

Seth

00:22:41.642 - 00:22:41.962

Yeah.

Drew

00:22:42.026 - 00:23:15.226

And that. But the one thing that they. But the whole movie is all about the Superman side of Superman.

Whereas in every other telling of Superman, you have the Clark Kent, him growing up as a human and dealing with human things, but then you also have his superhero real version of himself. And this movie was interesting to me because they humanized Superman more while completely neglecting his human side.

Like, we didn't even see him dawn on the geeky Clarkness. And he made it look cooler than it usually does.

Speaker C

00:23:15.298 - 00:23:18.778

I mean, he's a bit too sexy.

Seth

00:23:18.874 - 00:23:21.802

Yeah. He's kind of the nerd in real life. So.

Speaker C

00:23:21.826 - 00:23:23.978

I mean, he is actually the video game addict. Yeah.

Seth

00:23:23.994 - 00:23:29.046

He almost missed this audition. I'm sure it's one of your randos. He almost missed this audition because he was playing World of Warcraft.

Speaker C

00:23:29.098 - 00:23:31.406

Yeah. It's amazing. I actually didn't know that. It's amazing.

Seth

00:23:31.438 - 00:23:32.970

Oh, yeah. It's so great.

Drew

00:23:33.430 - 00:23:48.078

Yeah. That. So I. It was interesting to me because this Superman lacked a few of the things that make Superman Superman.

But I don't feel like it necessarily took away from the first movie.

Seth

00:23:48.174 - 00:23:48.478

Sure.

Drew

00:23:48.534 - 00:23:55.246

And later one, then this Batman versus Superman. Superman 100% becomes a plot device. And we can talk about that next week.

Seth

00:23:55.318 - 00:24:07.848

But yeah, see, I think I disagree with you because I feel like the majority of the movie focuses on him as Clark. It's him coming to terms with the fact that there are two versions of himself.

Drew

00:24:07.944 - 00:24:15.672

But you never see his human side. You're always seeing him as Clark dealing with supernatural stuff. I wear's the.

Seth

00:24:15.696 - 00:24:59.126

I mean, the whole thing about how he has the ability to do certain things but has to choose to hide it because that's what his dad has said is the best thing for him because the world wouldn't be ready to accept it. Like, again, it's. It's. He hasn't figured out who he is yet. So there is no geeky Clark yet. That's what happens in.

In BVs, where you actually do see a lot more of Clark in the whole office circumstances. But in this, it's. It's Again, something we have never seen on film before.

And that's him actually having to struggle with figuring out who is my public Persona, Clark Kent, and who am I actually. Superman.

Drew

00:24:59.238 - 00:25:20.726

See, I mean, different opinions are different opinions. I feel like this movie, all we see is him coming to terms with his alien side, which is fine. Which is. And that was the thrust of the movie.

But what was interesting to me was in the first time in movie, or maybe even Superman in general, there might be. Many people may know this is where I'm wrong, and for the first time, they'll correct us.

Seth

00:25:20.798 - 00:25:21.094

Yeah.

Drew

00:25:21.142 - 00:25:28.358

For the first time ever, we're seeing Superman with a much more human light. I mean, originally, super Superman doesn't kill people.

Seth

00:25:28.414 - 00:25:28.694

Yeah.

Drew

00:25:28.742 - 00:25:32.118

In this one, that is the crux of what he has to do to save the greater good.

Seth

00:25:32.174 - 00:25:32.454

Yeah.

Drew

00:25:32.502 - 00:25:50.422

And, you know, he is the archetype of the superheroes. Like, everything can be. This day can be saved. There can be no casualties, and everybody can win because of. Because Superman is able to save it.

This time, this movie, it was all about. There are consequences, there are costs, there are. You know, he had to make sacrifices.

Seth

00:25:50.486 - 00:25:50.822

Yeah.

Drew

00:25:50.886 - 00:25:56.358

And he had to save the day by killing someone. And then at the end, you get to see the turmoil he had from killing someone.

Seth

00:25:56.414 - 00:25:57.050

Yeah.

Speaker C

00:25:57.390 - 00:25:58.038

Yeah.

Drew

00:25:58.134 - 00:26:03.910

But I would argue they were maybe setting this up if. If the Snyderverse got its entirety. It was.

Seth

00:26:03.950 - 00:26:05.174

Snyder had a plan from the beginning.

Drew

00:26:05.222 - 00:26:13.518

It would have. It would have led to the Injustice storyline, and it would have led to Superman becoming a villain that Batman had to stop.

Seth

00:26:13.574 - 00:27:08.614

Yeah. Which I do feel like is worth mentioning. Snyder did have a fully drawn out plan from the very beginning as far as the movies he wanted to make.

He left all of the extras and spin offs up to Warner Brothers.

But basically, he said, my core movies are going to be man of Steel, bvs, Wonder Woman, Justice League, Ben Affleck, solo Batman movie that never got made, Aquaman, man of Steel two, and two more Justice League movies that was going to hit Injustice and then a final movie that was going to, according to reports, have a Return of the King level battle for Earth against Darkseid, and then was going to finish with a Flashpoint movie that would let Warner Brothers do whatever they wanted with the universe after that. So he. He had a plan.

And like I said, when you look at the box office numbers, it's clear that once Warner Brothers started putting their fingers and everything, that's when everything started to go down and they lost the plan that he had.

Speaker C

00:27:08.702 - 00:27:09.302

Interesting.

Seth

00:27:09.366 - 00:27:09.894

Yeah.

Speaker C

00:27:10.022 - 00:27:11.142

Yeah. What a mess.

Seth

00:27:11.246 - 00:27:11.930

Yeah.

Speaker C

00:27:13.070 - 00:27:14.102

We need a Hero.

Seth

00:27:14.166 - 00:27:17.370

Yeah, I need a hero.

Speaker C

00:27:17.870 - 00:27:22.998

I know that you have friends out there on Reddit talking about how this isn't canon, that nothing is canon.

Seth

00:27:23.094 - 00:27:25.590

I am banned from the Snyder Cut subreddit, so.

Speaker C

00:27:25.630 - 00:27:30.198

Oh, yeah, you are. I'm not gonna go in there. I just don't even shouldn't.

Seth

00:27:30.214 - 00:27:30.870

It's a show.

Speaker C

00:27:30.910 - 00:27:45.844

I don't want to deal with it. That's the thing. I get so afraid when we do these movies, because I know that, like, I'm stepping into it.

Like, last time we covered a Star wars movie because, you know, I don't like Star wars, but I tried to be as nice as possible. I. I wanted to quit podcasting. I was like, these people. I can't.

Drew

00:27:45.972 - 00:27:47.268

Which one did you cover?

Speaker C

00:27:47.404 - 00:27:54.996

The. The Fallen? No, that. We did start a Star Trek reboot versus I had a kid, remember?

Seth

00:27:55.028 - 00:27:56.276

It was Episode seven.

Drew

00:27:56.348 - 00:27:56.676

Okay.

Seth

00:27:56.708 - 00:27:58.580

So trilogy. Yeah.

Drew

00:27:58.660 - 00:27:59.428

So that's. That's interesting.

Speaker C

00:27:59.444 - 00:28:22.458

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. It was. It was a shit show. I'm sure. Like, I said Star Trek. I know I did, but I was just waiting and, like, somebody.

It's track, and I was like, I did say it, but I'm also, like, Filipino American. Okay. Give me a fucking break, all right. I have an aneurysm, though.

But if you have a friend that's spending too much time on Reddit, get them to take a break, listen to this podcast, calm their soul. This podcast can become canon to you.

Seth

00:28:22.514 - 00:28:23.018

There you go.

Drew

00:28:23.074 - 00:28:23.706

There we go.

Speaker C

00:28:23.778 - 00:28:24.426

That's right.

Seth

00:28:24.498 - 00:28:29.710

Imagine. Imagine Superman is destroying Nashville, and we're here just talking about it.

Speaker C

00:28:29.750 - 00:28:34.382

That's right. That's right. Oh, the Batman building just got blown up. Yeah, that's funny. The Batman.

Seth

00:28:34.446 - 00:28:35.438

The bitter rivalry.

Speaker C

00:28:35.534 - 00:28:37.966

We have a Batman building. Here's the AT&T building.

Seth

00:28:38.038 - 00:28:39.166

Google it. It's pretty great.

Drew

00:28:39.238 - 00:28:42.574

Yeah, it's fine. It somehow has become Nashville's identity.

Seth

00:28:42.702 - 00:28:43.294

Yeah.

Speaker C

00:28:43.422 - 00:28:44.158

So weird.

Seth

00:28:44.254 - 00:28:46.014

It's our Empire State Building.

Speaker C

00:28:46.182 - 00:28:53.262

Yeah. The question questions. Kevin Costner got pretty far into that tornado before he got sucked up. Huh?

Seth

00:28:53.326 - 00:28:53.790

For real, though.

Speaker C

00:28:53.830 - 00:29:02.870

Good Lord. That was like an F3. And he was basically standing. He was standing in the tornado for at least five.

It's like he should have been off the ground before it was even that close to him.

Drew

00:29:03.170 - 00:29:06.922

He should have just said, hey, Superman, can you go get the dog?

Seth

00:29:06.986 - 00:29:29.546

Yeah. Yeah. That. Honestly, that one sequence is probably my biggest gripe with the movie is I think.

I think that whole thing could have been handled way better. Like, I get they wanted to kill him off to give Superman a little bit more to, like, you know, ground him to Earth. But. Yeah.

I just don't think that whole scene was done as well as it could have been.

Drew

00:29:29.618 - 00:29:47.882

Yeah, I don't. I think they could have done it better. I don't quite know how, but. You're right. It just kind of. I get what they were trying to do and they.

They just jumped right into it. Killed him off. And as a viewer, you're just like, okay, I guess that. I mean. But as a suit.

As a Superman fan, I know that part of Superman's develop is the death of his father.

Seth

00:29:48.026 - 00:29:51.626

I was kind of in the Animated Series. His parents are both alive in the Animated Series.

Drew

00:29:51.698 - 00:30:05.354

True. But I was kind of bummed that they didn't. I mean, because one of the.

For lack of better word, beautiful parts of Clark's dad's passing is it's usually by some kind of, like, heart attack or something. Something that's outside of Superman's control.

Seth

00:30:05.442 - 00:30:05.754

Yeah.

Drew

00:30:05.802 - 00:30:19.754

And that's a big thing for him to overcome. Because part of the appeal to Superman fans is when Clark has to deal. Superman has to deal with things that. That he can't solve. So anytime.

Kryptonites. And that's a. That's a big plot device.

Seth

00:30:19.802 - 00:30:20.074

Yeah.

Drew

00:30:20.122 - 00:30:34.978

But also anytime there's sickness that's like, in human error, that's it. That's a sickness. That's a problem. Anytime people he loves. I mean, that's the big thing with the injustice. One, he goes crazy once Lois dies.

And then another one people forget about often about, like, magic really messes with him.

Seth

00:30:35.034 - 00:30:35.314

Yeah.

Drew

00:30:35.362 - 00:30:45.346

It's like, those are so. It's always fun to see. That's how you humanize Superman a little bit. By putting him up against things that his powers can't fix.

Seth

00:30:45.458 - 00:31:01.038

Yeah. Which to compare, I do appreciate what Zack Snyder was trying to do with this scene where he knew he could have saved him.

And his struggle was respecting his father's wishes by not doing the thing he knew he could have done.

Drew

00:31:01.094 - 00:31:09.070

How long do you think Martha got. Had. Got. How long did it take her to get over the fact that her son could have just ran in there and saved her husband?

Speaker C

00:31:09.150 - 00:31:10.382

She never seemed too bothered by it.

Drew

00:31:10.406 - 00:31:10.926

She was like.

Seth

00:31:10.998 - 00:31:28.650

I mean, in the movie, they talk about it, like, in the scene before he goes. Well, it's when she's in the destroyed house. They kind of do touch on it. And.

And I think she kind of understood, like, what his purpose in not letting Clark save him was. But. Yeah, again, that. That's probably my biggest.

Drew

00:31:28.730 - 00:31:33.226

That was a big mom moment there. She realized there's there's what I want to say and what I need to say to my child.

Speaker C

00:31:33.298 - 00:31:40.410

Yeah, that tornado looked horrible. I'm sorry. The CGI was bad. It made the twister CGI look, like, incredible. And.

Seth

00:31:40.450 - 00:31:41.178

Yeah, yeah.

Speaker C

00:31:41.194 - 00:31:50.870

And he. He was standing way too far into that tornado. He should have been sucked up. Like, that kind of tornado would.

Sucked you up like, well before it got to that point. But he's just standing there with the debris just like, that's gonna kill me.

Seth

00:31:51.410 - 00:31:59.514

It looked cool. It did look cool. And I get it as far as, like, the visual thing, but. No, I agree with you. That scene is. Is. It's the one thing I'm like, with.

Drew

00:31:59.602 - 00:32:06.042

With the Snyder movies. I do sometimes get tired of the every. The.

Seth

00:32:06.146 - 00:32:06.458

The.

Speaker C

00:32:06.514 - 00:32:06.874

The.

Drew

00:32:06.962 - 00:32:17.614

The pressure to make everything look like a visual masterpiece. And the. All the. The later you get the visions and the dreams and you get the. Everything's supposed to be like an allegory.

Seth

00:32:17.742 - 00:32:18.142

Yeah.

Drew

00:32:18.206 - 00:32:21.886

Sometimes I like watching things and just like, oh, there's a man being sucked up by a tornado.

Seth

00:32:21.918 - 00:32:42.132

Yeah, sure. But then again, you're watching a superhero movie directly after the Avengers had come out.

Like, there had to be some visual spectacle to kind of let it. The beginning of the dceu live up to that. So, yeah, there was definitely pressure on both sides. It definitely could have been better.

But I also don't think it was shit. It was all right, but, yeah, definitely not the best.

Speaker C

00:32:42.206 - 00:33:00.728

I had a lot of stupid comedian thoughts during that scene. I was like, what if. What if his dad died because he was like, like Superman used his vision to, like, laser off a melanoma and, like.

And accidentally like, pierced his dad's brain or something. It's like. It's like. Damn it. I knew we should have just gone to the dermatologist. I'm Superman. I'm not a scientist. I don't know.

Drew

00:33:00.864 - 00:33:03.016

Dad was all like, we don't have insurance, son.

Seth

00:33:03.048 - 00:33:04.184

It's either this or I die.

Speaker C

00:33:04.232 - 00:33:09.756

You better use that laser vision, by the way. The gas is off. Can you cook within the skillet there? Just heat it up, son.

Seth

00:33:09.788 - 00:33:12.600

I'm tired of wearing glasses. Can you do Lasix on me?

Drew

00:33:13.220 - 00:33:16.040

I don't want those damn doctors. They track you for the government.

Speaker C

00:33:16.740 - 00:33:47.718

Yeah. Where I'm from, that's exactly how we would use if, like, I adopted an alien superhero in accident. I've been using the superpowers to.

With people like, hey, Jimmy, Jimmy the neighbor. Why don't you go burn the cat? The hair off his cat. So he's just naked yeah. Next question. I don't care how advanced the Kryptonians are.

Who the fuck architected the designs of these UFOs? They are like this all over. First of all, they kind of look like someone watched Prometheus. Yeah, they got that. And the suits have the look.

Seth

00:33:47.774 - 00:33:49.046

Prometheus came out after this.

Speaker C

00:33:49.118 - 00:33:51.062

That's. Oh, really? That's crazy. Oh, yeah.

Seth

00:33:51.126 - 00:33:52.998

Since 2014, that's crazy.

Speaker C

00:33:53.094 - 00:33:58.310

They look like Prometheus, and then the UFOs are just, like, random and weird. Like, that doesn't look very aerodynamic.

Drew

00:33:58.390 - 00:34:02.966

Yeah, I mean, it looks like a giant tooth just coming down there for space.

Seth

00:34:03.038 - 00:34:05.334

They're not supposed to be aerodynamic, you idiot.

Speaker C

00:34:05.382 - 00:34:06.430

I care.

Drew

00:34:06.810 - 00:34:08.802

Brought to you by your neighborhood dentist.

Seth

00:34:08.866 - 00:34:09.670

I don't.

Speaker C

00:34:10.250 - 00:34:16.290

They don't look very effective, even. Okay, you're right. Okay, that was dumb. They're not. They're for space. But still, even then, don't.

Drew

00:34:16.370 - 00:34:18.226

Don't you need some space flight?

Speaker C

00:34:18.258 - 00:34:21.202

Yeah, I don't go to space. What did you go to space?

Seth

00:34:21.306 - 00:34:22.466

Vacuum of space works.

Speaker C

00:34:22.498 - 00:34:24.002

I don't know how space works.

Drew

00:34:24.146 - 00:34:49.306

I don't know. I. I had questions about them from the very beginning when they were like. Instead of saying, like, hey, we should all leave Krypton.

It's about to blow up, they were like, hey, I'm going to leave Krypton. And how weird was like, them infusing the Codex with Clark and. Or Kal El.

And, like, it's like the whole time I'm just like, is this, like, the best way to do all of this?

Seth

00:34:49.378 - 00:34:55.514

Well, I mean, remember, at that point, you're dealing with the downfalls of. Of that kind of governmental system.

Speaker C

00:34:55.602 - 00:34:55.914

Yeah.

Seth

00:34:55.962 - 00:35:05.530

Is what he's trying to do when there's so much red tape that you can't even agree, hey, we should leave this fucking rock. Yeah, Like, I. Again, I get it. I don't. I don't have a problem with it.

Drew

00:35:05.650 - 00:35:10.522

I mean, it was. It was fun to watch. It was the intro to the movie. But the whole time I'm like, yeah, they could all just, like, also, the.

Seth

00:35:10.546 - 00:35:14.058

First time on film that we've actually seen the origin of Superman.

Speaker C

00:35:14.154 - 00:35:14.858

Yeah, so.

Seth

00:35:14.914 - 00:35:32.970

Because that wasn't really. I think it was very briefly in the very first one, but nothing in depth, where you.

Again, to me, it just gives you more of an idea of where he came from and. And. And why he's so split, because he very clearly has the two pieces of him pulling himself apart.

Drew

00:35:33.130 - 00:35:39.674

Well, to me, when I watched it, it was. It was setting up the fact that they were really gonna focus More on the alien side of Superman.

Seth

00:35:39.722 - 00:35:40.042

Yeah.

Drew

00:35:40.106 - 00:35:49.418

Like the whole. I mean, and then, you know, Zod coming back. I mean, that's a. Yeah.

I mean, that Zod is a very alien villain for Superman versus Lex Luthor, who's a very human.

Seth

00:35:49.554 - 00:36:00.226

Which I think, honestly, it was a good idea to start with Zod and have the little nods to LexCorp and Wayne Tech. As you see during the big fight scenes, there's a couple of those.

Speaker C

00:36:00.298 - 00:36:00.642

Yeah.

Seth

00:36:00.706 - 00:36:15.666

Pieces put together. But no, I, I, I do think it was solid to start with an alien villain to, to give him a reason to decide, do I give a.

About Earth or am I just gonna do the thing? Like, am I gonna go back with these people because they're my blood.

Speaker C

00:36:15.778 - 00:36:16.066

Yeah.

Drew

00:36:16.098 - 00:36:33.722

I thought, I thought, I thought Zod was a great villain. I thought Michael Shannon was so good. I thought, I love him. The.

Any, Any time that, I mean, that big old fight at the end between the two of them, that was, that was, that was, that was like. If I hadn't already been caring about the movie, that's, that would have been like. All right, this is what I'm ready to watch.

Speaker C

00:36:33.826 - 00:36:36.630

Yeah. Yeah. Back to the UFO design.

Seth

00:36:38.130 - 00:36:38.874

My bad.

Speaker C

00:36:38.962 - 00:37:01.214

No, no, it's all good. That's why the questions are here. It generates discussion. Right. We're digging under rocks. It's great. I did want to come back to one more thing.

I do think this just hit me. By the way, the UFOs do look like they're designed by someone that lives on a planet where they're no longer having sex. You know, they are.

They're no longer having sex. They are making. They're making these babies in tubes. They're no longer. They're basically not allowed to have sex anymore.

Seth

00:37:01.262 - 00:37:01.582

Yeah.

Speaker C

00:37:01.646 - 00:37:02.446

You can tell.

Seth

00:37:02.598 - 00:37:03.022

Go ahead.

Speaker C

00:37:03.046 - 00:37:09.838

This guy was taking his frustration out on designing these UFOs. That's why they're all elongated. You know, he's like, oh, what I would do to this thing.

Seth

00:37:09.894 - 00:37:13.838

It's like car designs. After everyone stopped doing acid and started doing cocaine.

Speaker C

00:37:13.934 - 00:37:14.638

Yeah.

Drew

00:37:14.814 - 00:37:31.074

How many. How many people were having a good time on the. That spaceship when the big old laser was drilling the earth, going up and down and up and down.

We need more soldiers to send. They're all preoccupied. And that's it. Yeah.

Speaker C

00:37:31.122 - 00:37:32.338

That is now how they get off.

Seth

00:37:32.394 - 00:37:33.030

Yeah.

Drew

00:37:33.850 - 00:37:38.018

Finally, we can set off the world engine. Not yours, Jimmy.

Seth

00:37:38.114 - 00:37:39.362

The actual one.

Drew

00:37:39.546 - 00:37:41.750

Put your pants back on and press the button.

Seth

00:37:42.090 - 00:37:54.378

I do think the biggest disadvantage coming to even just the world builder ships. I think the biggest disadvantage this movie had Just going into it was having four years of Marvel previous to it.

Speaker C

00:37:54.434 - 00:37:54.714

Yeah.

Seth

00:37:54.762 - 00:38:20.780

Because with.

With Iron man and Even Iron Man 2 and Captain America and Thor, like, they were really able to start small scale and build into the Avengers levels threat, which. Which I think is one reason why post End Game, everything just feels ridiculous because somehow they're trying to top End game with this.

They had to top Avengers before they could even put the Justice League together. Like, they had to make a spectacle.

Drew

00:38:20.860 - 00:38:30.396

And I think that might have been where they might have gone wrong because if they had gone into it knowing that that's where they wanted to go.

Seth

00:38:30.468 - 00:38:30.860

Yeah.

Drew

00:38:30.940 - 00:39:04.720

But really focusing on, like, we're not, you know, we're on level one of the series. Yeah. So we need to keep it on level every. Everything about the entire, like all the Snyderverse movies is setting up for the Justice League.

Setting up for. And instead of keeping up with Jones, they're keeping up with Marvel. And I think, I think that might have been.

And I, I get it because like, you know, fans are thinking it and saying it and it's all around you when you're making these news like, oh, is it going to be as good as the Avengers or is it going to be as a comedian? When you say, like, I have a show next week and they're like, oh, is it at Zany's?

Seth

00:39:06.420 - 00:39:10.292

It's like, oh, it's in a brewery in the back room.

Speaker C

00:39:10.476 - 00:39:10.868

But.

Drew

00:39:10.924 - 00:39:16.388

But when you do those brewery shows, you're like, this is going to be the best damn brewery show in this back room.

Seth

00:39:16.444 - 00:39:16.884

Oh, yeah.

Drew

00:39:16.932 - 00:39:27.604

And then maybe one day it'll set me up for the Zany show or whatever. But like, so I feel like everything about these movies always went back to like, we're going to make an amazing masterpiece in four movies.

Speaker C

00:39:27.732 - 00:39:46.042

Yeah. And I feel like, I feel like one. The big differences between Snyder and the MCU is Snyder, like, bit off a lot from the source material.

Like, even though I don't know the source material, what I did in research, he borrowed especially as he progresses towards Justice League for the. With the next few films. I say a few. The next two films, including Josh. Whatever.

Seth

00:39:46.106 - 00:39:46.346

Yeah.

Speaker C

00:39:46.378 - 00:39:56.874

It's hard. It's hard to say, but they, He. He basically picked. Picked a lot of different scenarios from the comic books.

And I think mcu, they kept it pretty simplistic, comparatively.

Seth

00:39:56.922 - 00:39:57.146

Yeah.

Speaker C

00:39:57.178 - 00:40:04.458

I think they were more like, we're gonna do a lot of these. Let's not try to like, overdo the source material. Let's not try to please everyone. We're Gonna like, kind of cherry pick.

Drew

00:40:04.514 - 00:40:09.478

I'm not sure why he did that. That just to me, if you're making a movie, I don't know if, like.

Seth

00:40:09.614 - 00:40:41.874

Because he's a comic, Stan, he absolutely adores the comics. And so I'm sure going into it, he was like, oh, we could do this, we could do this, we could do this. And yeah, I can see how.

How again, I don't really know as much, especially about the Superman and DC comics overall, but I can see how for people who love those watching pieces get pulled from all over the place and get put into what I felt like just as a movie watcher was a reasonably cohesive story, I could see how you'd be like, wait, why is this here and this is here and this is here? Like, I could see how that would.

Speaker C

00:40:41.882 - 00:40:46.898

Be because he altered it to fit together. So he's. He's both taking and like breaking them down.

Drew

00:40:46.954 - 00:40:47.314

Yeah.

Speaker C

00:40:47.362 - 00:40:51.154

Then, yeah. If you really do care about the canon, I'm sure it pissed you off at that point.

Drew

00:40:51.242 - 00:40:58.274

It almost seems like it'd be easier and better to either pick one or. Or pick, you know, a couple. I mean, he picked like 15 at some point.

Seth

00:40:58.282 - 00:40:58.870

Yeah.

Drew

00:40:59.690 - 00:41:15.518

Or, you know, this is a nice thing that people should do more often in movies. Make something new. Like. Yeah.

Like you, you know, give Superman a new threat that he hasn't had to deal with yet or, you know, later or with the Justice League or something like inflation.

Seth

00:41:15.614 - 00:41:16.558

Yeah, right.

Drew

00:41:16.694 - 00:41:20.958

What do you do when the cost of living. You have no powers that help you with the cost of living?

Speaker C

00:41:21.134 - 00:41:23.650

Versus Versus JP Morgan.

Seth

00:41:24.390 - 00:41:26.462

Superman versus the Federal Reserve.

Drew

00:41:26.526 - 00:41:32.254

What if the whole second movie was just about, like, focused on his. The lawsuit. The government was.

Speaker C

00:41:32.342 - 00:41:33.038

Yeah.

Drew

00:41:33.214 - 00:41:36.638

Superman Attorney at law. Yeah.

Speaker C

00:41:36.654 - 00:41:50.378

Instead of journalist. Last question. Superman may have saved humanity, but what the are they coming back to besides $2 trillion worth of property damage?

Where am I gonna live? Where am I gonna work? I don't know if my family's alive. Thanks, Superman.

Seth

00:41:50.474 - 00:41:53.642

I mean, the Avengers literally destroyed half of Manhattan.

Speaker C

00:41:53.706 - 00:41:54.490

Yeah, it's true.

Seth

00:41:54.570 - 00:42:29.158

I mean, here's. Okay, so this was a huge gripe, which I am. Spoiler alert. I.

I very much appreciate the fact that in the directly next movie, two years later, they hardcore start dealing with the reality of the damage that was caused physically. The MCU didn't do it until, I think 2016 or 17 with Civil War.

So they had two Avengers movies and every other solo movie before they even thought about approaching. Hey. We kind of literally destroyed New York City.

Speaker C

00:42:29.214 - 00:42:29.686

Yeah.

Seth

00:42:29.798 - 00:42:40.254

Here a. It's Par for the course as far as the Animated Series goes. Like I said, they are knocking down buildings left and right. And he'll.

He'll catch it, get everyone out, and then just let it collapse.

Speaker C

00:42:40.302 - 00:42:40.574

Yeah.

Seth

00:42:40.622 - 00:42:43.054

Like, he would have been horrible to have on 9 11.

Speaker C

00:42:43.142 - 00:42:44.382

Yeah. Yeah.

Seth

00:42:44.446 - 00:42:52.366

But I don't know. I. It's par for the course of superhero movies, and I feel like they dealt with it pretty quickly as far as, like, series like this.

Drew

00:42:52.438 - 00:43:38.714

Yeah. I mean, in the next movie, they. They have scenes where, you know, Batman's there and trying to save someone. That doesn't. I mean. Yeah, yeah.

It is cool to see that the destruction comes to play in later plots, devices, and also just in comic books in general. That is usually a good start to another story is, you know, you watch the next. You read the next comic, you watch the next episode, you do the next.

Whatever next. See the next movie. And it starts with. As the damage is happening, someone gets hurt, and then someone else turns to a villain because of that.

And that really, you know, this was the first time the world saw Superman. So them seeing all that damage. There was the two kinds of people.

The people that, you know, would end up, like, worshiping him and seeing him as a hero because he saved us from the aliens. But then there's other people. Like, I had a house and children.

Seth

00:43:38.882 - 00:43:41.030

I had one more payment on that car.

Speaker C

00:43:41.410 - 00:43:41.882

Yeah.

Drew

00:43:41.946 - 00:43:56.634

It was one thing I noticed that was kind of interesting because it goes along with the Superman that he's creating in this movie is usually Superman is all about saving people first and then fighting the bad guy.

Seth

00:43:56.682 - 00:43:57.278

Yeah.

Drew

00:43:57.434 - 00:44:03.846

And at the beginning, we see him do some heroics, you know, with the ship and a couple of the school bus. When he's a kid.

Seth

00:44:03.878 - 00:44:04.134

Yeah.

Drew

00:44:04.182 - 00:44:09.526

But during that fight, man, like, it's kick Zod's ass and save people on the side.

Seth

00:44:09.598 - 00:44:13.926

But also, remember, this is technically his first actual outing.

Drew

00:44:14.118 - 00:44:14.566

Absolutely.

Speaker C

00:44:14.598 - 00:44:14.742

So.

Drew

00:44:14.766 - 00:44:43.560

But it. But it is interesting that they really. And that. That's the thing that comes into play in all the movies is you do. And it goes back to.

They're just painting a darker pictures of superheroes. Like we. At that stage point, all we've ever seen is the bright, happy, peppy, you know, always good guys, superheroes. Now we're seeing.

We're seeing the dark sides of them. No pun intended. We're seeing the. We're seeing the issues. We're seeing them as flawed heroes.

It eventually leads into series like the boys and invincible. And like.

Seth

00:44:43.600 - 00:44:46.744

Yeah, I was about to say Snyder got stomped on. So the boys could run.

Speaker C

00:44:46.832 - 00:44:47.336

Yeah.

Drew

00:44:47.448 - 00:45:18.394

The Dark Knight kind of showed that we had interest in kind of dark. The Dark Knight series showed that we had an interest in. To kind of more emo superheroes a little bit.

The Snyderverse kind of helped us get there, and now we actually. It's kind of interesting. I feel like we're actually on the other end of the pendulum. We've been getting tired of that. We've also survived a pandemic.

We also have enough dark people in our world running our governments and doing our things. We're ready for a bit more light stuff. So I really think that this next Superman movie, we're not going to see him as dark.

We're not going to see him as.

Seth

00:45:18.482 - 00:45:20.490

Oh, no. James Gunn has been very clear about that.

Drew

00:45:20.610 - 00:45:22.282

He's going to be more classic Superman.

Seth

00:45:22.346 - 00:45:22.586

Yeah.

Speaker C

00:45:22.618 - 00:45:22.994

Yeah.

Drew

00:45:23.082 - 00:45:35.122

But it's just interesting to. When you're watching this movie that you're reminded of this was the start of us kind of as a culture.

People that like superhero movies, kind of wanting to see them struggle.

Seth

00:45:35.186 - 00:45:35.474

Yeah.

Drew

00:45:35.522 - 00:45:41.778

Kind of want to see them do the. Kind of want to see me get pissed at the drunk guy and throw this big old semi truck into a power line.

Seth

00:45:41.834 - 00:45:42.258

Yeah.

Drew

00:45:42.354 - 00:45:50.538

Regardless of the ramifications it has for the rest of the small town and the power outages that were bound to happen in the amount of money that that was going to cost everyone.

Speaker C

00:45:50.674 - 00:45:54.650

Just send them to the dmv. Right. Superman goes to the dmv.

Drew

00:45:54.730 - 00:45:55.390

Yeah.

Speaker C

00:45:56.530 - 00:45:57.418

Rando.

Seth

00:45:57.514 - 00:45:58.346

Rando.

Drew

00:45:58.458 - 00:45:59.498

Randos.

Speaker C

00:45:59.674 - 00:46:09.354

This is crazy. Henry Cavill actually auditioned for Superman Returns, like, before it was even called that so early. And he got rejected.

He was devastated because he loves Superman.

Seth

00:46:09.402 - 00:46:09.674

Yeah.

Speaker C

00:46:09.722 - 00:46:14.362

But then eventually he was elated and ecstatic when he got this one. But it's kind of crazy that he.

Seth

00:46:14.386 - 00:46:15.466

Almost missed the audition.

Speaker C

00:46:15.578 - 00:46:18.106

And he almost missed the audition because he was playing World of Warcraft.

Seth

00:46:18.138 - 00:46:19.922

Yeah. That's funny.

Speaker C

00:46:19.986 - 00:46:24.914

I didn't know that. But I didn't know that he was, like, excited to be Geralt because he loves Witcher.

Seth

00:46:24.962 - 00:46:31.458

Yeah. He's just the king of getting the perfect role for him and then having studios it out of him.

Speaker C

00:46:31.514 - 00:46:34.098

Yeah. And then he's doing Warhammer, but he's.

Seth

00:46:34.114 - 00:46:37.602

A producer on that, so he has a little bit more creative control on that one.

Drew

00:46:37.706 - 00:46:44.626

Can you guys picture him as the Brandon Routh version of Superman? Like, I feel like he did such a better job at this one.

Seth

00:46:44.698 - 00:46:45.042

Yeah.

Drew

00:46:45.106 - 00:46:52.228

And I mean, as an actor, maybe he could do the. That one, but I just. I don't think I wouldn't. I I can't really picture it as much.

Seth

00:46:52.284 - 00:47:13.358

Yeah, same. No, I, I. That again, that movie. Brian Singer directed it. He tried hard to balance that. Happy go lucky Superman with a little bit of darkness.

Like the scene where Kevin Spacey comes back as Lex Luthor and the dog is eating the other dog. Like. Yeah, random like that. To try to add some. Some darkness to it. But I just totally did not.

Drew

00:47:13.414 - 00:47:20.302

Superman Returns might be my least favorite. Superman. It felt like. It felt like a chick flick with Superman. It was like a romantic movie.

Seth

00:47:20.366 - 00:47:20.606

Yeah.

Drew

00:47:20.638 - 00:47:24.926

Like Superman made by Lifetime. Like, it's legitimately.

Speaker C

00:47:25.038 - 00:47:28.318

Yeah. Good thing he made his. Good thing he made his bones here.

Seth

00:47:28.374 - 00:47:28.654

Yeah.

Drew

00:47:28.702 - 00:47:29.246

Right. Yeah.

Seth

00:47:29.278 - 00:47:29.970

Yeah.

Speaker C

00:47:30.390 - 00:47:43.684

Ben Affleck was originally going to direct this. Yeah. Zack Snyder, before he directed this. Ben Affleck was given the chance to direct this.

So that's before he was actually cast as Batman and B versus. Yeah. He turned it down because he had never made a movie with so many visual effects shots.

Seth

00:47:43.732 - 00:47:44.100

That's fair.

Speaker C

00:47:44.140 - 00:47:44.692

That's what he said.

Seth

00:47:44.716 - 00:47:45.556

Because he had done fair.

Speaker C

00:47:45.628 - 00:47:48.388

But he was riding hot off of Argo 1 Best Picture.

Seth

00:47:48.564 - 00:47:49.012

Yeah.

Speaker C

00:47:49.076 - 00:47:53.972

But that's a very organic movie that movies like, probably got very limited vfx.

Drew

00:47:54.036 - 00:48:05.852

Can you imagine if he was directing and he had to at one point come to Henry Cavill, like, so I get what you're going through. Back when we did Daredevil, that is known as one of the worst superhero movies.

Seth

00:48:05.956 - 00:48:12.316

I watched it for the first time a couple years ago. Definitely not great, but nowhere near as bad as people said it was.

Drew

00:48:12.388 - 00:48:12.780

Yeah.

Seth

00:48:12.860 - 00:48:14.156

Like, it had some solid moments.

Speaker C

00:48:14.188 - 00:48:14.604

Which ones?

Drew

00:48:14.652 - 00:48:15.116

Daredevil.

Seth

00:48:15.148 - 00:48:16.460

Daredevil with Ben Affleck.

Speaker C

00:48:16.540 - 00:48:16.892

Yeah.

Seth

00:48:16.956 - 00:48:18.892

And Jennifer Garner as Elektra.

Drew

00:48:18.956 - 00:48:29.452

It was fine. Yeah, it was, you know, it was fun. It was. I think sometimes you watch, sometimes the superhero movies are just meant to be fun and exciting.

And if you too hard, you're like, well, my brain starts hurting.

Seth

00:48:29.516 - 00:48:38.998

Yeah. And it was being compared to the Spider man movies and the Blade movies and the X Men movies at the time. So, I mean.

Yeah, it definitely didn't live up to any of those, but it was. It was all right.

Speaker C

00:48:39.054 - 00:48:43.670

And that was a transition period. Like, you know, like the superhero genre was changing.

Seth

00:48:43.750 - 00:48:44.102

Yeah.

Speaker C

00:48:44.166 - 00:48:44.742

Rapidly.

Seth

00:48:44.806 - 00:48:45.094

Yeah.

Drew

00:48:45.142 - 00:48:48.210

And Electro was very formative in my early years.

Speaker C

00:48:50.670 - 00:48:52.326

I haven't watched that in a long time.

Seth

00:48:52.398 - 00:48:52.646

Yeah.

Speaker C

00:48:52.678 - 00:48:53.878

I probably won't ever watch it again.

Seth

00:48:53.934 - 00:48:57.238

Yeah. I was about to say it's not worth a rewatch, but it was fun the one time.

Speaker C

00:48:57.374 - 00:49:05.614

Sure. The first cut of this was three and a half hours long. So the runtime is 143 minutes. But originally this was going to be like the other ones.

It was going to be a lot longer hours.

Seth

00:49:05.702 - 00:49:06.638

I'm not surprised.

Drew

00:49:06.734 - 00:49:17.134

I, you know, I, I, it's, I both, I love seeing the extra content of these movies, but I also feel like releasing the extra version at times is a bit lazy.

Seth

00:49:17.182 - 00:50:17.286

Like, I mean, again, so here's, People say that with Snyder a lot, especially after the Rebel Moon movies have come out and with Zack Snyder's Justice League, here is what happens, okay? He goes and he, he gives the studio the script and he's like, this is the movie I want to make. And they're like, cool.

Then he goes and makes that movie. And then the studio comes in and they're like, hey, you got to not make that movie. You've got to make this version of that movie. And then it almost.

Other than man of Steel, I don't know what an extended cut of man of Steel would look like. And I don't even know if it would be any good. Yeah, there's probably a reason he's never released an extended cut.

That being said, with both BVs and with his version of Justice League and both versions of, or both parts of Rebel Moon, his version, which his definitive version is usually the extended cut is significantly better than what the studio makes him put out. So I don't think it's lazy. I think he's literally bowing to the overlords at the studios, doing what they're telling him to do.

They realize it's not great. He's like, well, let's try my version out. And then everyone loves it more.

Speaker C

00:50:17.358 - 00:50:17.782

Right?

Seth

00:50:17.886 - 00:50:27.958

So I don't think that's his fault. He just gets fucked into making a shorter movie than he wants to. And then they're like, oh, we'll put all that stuff back.

And then they're like, ah, okay, this was actually a good.

Drew

00:50:28.014 - 00:50:31.790

And then they get to make twice as much money for releasing the same movie.

Speaker C

00:50:32.850 - 00:50:36.874

It's probably just footage of the horny Kryptons making. Yeah, making UFOs.

Seth

00:50:36.922 - 00:50:37.386

Yeah.

Speaker C

00:50:37.498 - 00:50:42.138

Making sexually ambiguous UFOs. That's all it is. It's just an hour and a half of that.

Seth

00:50:42.194 - 00:50:42.426

Yeah.

Drew

00:50:42.458 - 00:50:47.818

Or maybe it's more of his, his first day at the Daily Planet at the end of the movie. It's like shows him, you know, getting.

Seth

00:50:47.874 - 00:50:52.122

His first story and a 20 minute sex scene of Russell Crowe making, Making Clark.

Drew

00:50:52.186 - 00:50:55.018

Yeah, I forgot Russell Crowe was in that movie.

Seth

00:50:55.114 - 00:50:56.910

I love that he's in that movie.

Drew

00:50:57.600 - 00:51:03.720

I just, every time I see Him. I think of Gladiator. I just. And every role, like, I feel like it's just Gladiator doing it.

Seth

00:51:03.760 - 00:51:09.352

Apparently whenever he goes to Italy, he's just treated like actual royalty there, because that's amazing. It's so funny.

Drew

00:51:09.416 - 00:51:10.472

As well he should.

Speaker C

00:51:10.576 - 00:51:12.700

That's funny. All I think about is the crow.

Drew

00:51:14.800 - 00:51:15.864

Only wicked prayer.

Speaker C

00:51:15.912 - 00:51:25.524

Only wicked prayer. Henry Cavill said the most difficult scene to shoot was the shirtless scene coming out of the water before when he goes out and does the oil tanker.

Because he refused to do steroids.

Seth

00:51:25.572 - 00:51:25.972

Yeah.

Speaker C

00:51:26.036 - 00:51:33.460

Which is kind of disappointing because he looks really great without steroids. I'm like, dear God, genetics rule you. Nice jeans.

Drew

00:51:33.620 - 00:51:35.844

Nice for the rest of us if we learned he was on Sarah.

Speaker C

00:51:35.892 - 00:51:52.180

Yeah. I kind of needed him to be on steroids for my own personal. But he wouldn't take performance enhancing drugs.

But he also refused to let them touch him up with vfx. Yeah. So it was really difficult because he knew that they wanted him to look bigger. They wanted to look more jacked, but he wouldn't do either.

So it was kind of. There's a lot of tension, so.

Seth

00:51:52.220 - 00:51:52.436

Yeah.

Speaker C

00:51:52.468 - 00:51:57.232

And I think there was some insecurity about coming out in that scene out of the water, knowing that, like, probably they wanted him to look.

Drew

00:51:57.256 - 00:51:57.456

Yeah.

Seth

00:51:57.488 - 00:51:59.200

Well, he also refused to shave his chest.

Speaker C

00:51:59.280 - 00:52:00.320

Yep. That was a big deal.

Seth

00:52:00.360 - 00:52:10.256

Yeah. They wanted to shave his chest. And he was like, no, Superman is Clark Kent, who is a human. Why? Why is he gonna look like a figurine of a superhero?

He's. He's a man. Let him have.

Speaker C

00:52:10.328 - 00:52:10.912

Yeah.

Seth

00:52:11.056 - 00:52:12.192

Hair in his chest.

Speaker C

00:52:12.336 - 00:52:17.392

Yeah. Especially if he's hanging out with all the oil tanker guys out there and the fishermen and doesn't want to get made fun of.

Drew

00:52:17.416 - 00:52:18.320

Her being a, you know.

Speaker C

00:52:18.360 - 00:52:18.800

Yeah.

Seth

00:52:18.880 - 00:52:20.160

Smooth chested boy.

Speaker C

00:52:20.240 - 00:52:22.384

I don't know a lot of lobster men shaving their chest.

Seth

00:52:22.432 - 00:52:22.704

Yeah.

Speaker C

00:52:22.752 - 00:52:24.286

You know? Yeah, yeah.

Drew

00:52:24.408 - 00:52:33.634

You know, that's. But how interesting is that, though? It, like, if Henry Cavill is really self conscious about a scene because of his outward appearance.

Speaker C

00:52:33.682 - 00:52:34.274

Yeah.

Drew

00:52:34.402 - 00:52:38.274

Then, like, next time you're self conscious, just remember, like, I'm not alone.

Speaker C

00:52:38.322 - 00:52:41.218

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm kind of.

Seth

00:52:41.274 - 00:52:42.146

We all struggle.

Speaker C

00:52:42.258 - 00:52:44.738

Yeah. Even that specimen.

Seth

00:52:44.834 - 00:52:45.346

Yeah.

Speaker C

00:52:45.458 - 00:52:55.966

Yeah. Last rando here. This is kind of crazy and I would love to hear kind of your takes on this because I am not, like, I'm a big. Like, when I.

When I talk about sports, I like uniform. You know what I mean? Like, I'm like, oh, I love those. All black, you know, whatever.

Seth

00:52:55.998 - 00:52:56.574

Yeah.

Speaker C

00:52:56.702 - 00:53:03.770

But they wanted. Snyder wanted the red trunks. And it actually wasn't until I read this random that I realized I was like, oh, he didn't have red trunks on.

Seth

00:53:04.070 - 00:53:05.998

Which was a point of contention at the time.

Speaker C

00:53:06.054 - 00:53:13.374

It was. And the problem was is they did 1500 designs with the red trunks and he said they just never landed on one that worked.

Drew

00:53:13.422 - 00:53:23.022

Yeah, I like it without the red trunks. I've always. I've always thought the red trunks are dumb. I.

I love it when people make fun of that about Superman that he wears his underwear on the outside.

Seth

00:53:23.126 - 00:53:23.582

Yeah.

Drew

00:53:23.646 - 00:53:30.458

If. You know what? If Superman was.

And he came flying through Nashville after I thanked him for saving us, I would turn to you and make fun of his red underwear too.

Seth

00:53:30.514 - 00:53:38.010

Yeah, yeah. I mean, same. I. Especially with how his suit ends up being basically Kryptonian under armour.

Speaker C

00:53:38.090 - 00:53:38.394

Yeah.

Seth

00:53:38.442 - 00:53:43.818

Like, no, I think it makes sense to not have the trunks. And I think it's kind of a dumb decision for James Gunn to put him back on.

Drew

00:53:43.874 - 00:54:01.020

Yeah, maybe. Maybe they were like, maybe the trunks was when, you know, back in other versions of Superman, his mom helps him make his costume. And so like.

But like he gets the suit from Krypton. So maybe. Yeah, maybe it's really Kryptonians because they don't have sex. They also don't wear underwear.

Speaker C

00:54:01.100 - 00:54:01.760

Yeah.

Drew

00:54:02.100 - 00:54:06.480

And so there was no need for the red trunks. And it was. It would have been a design flaw.

Seth

00:54:07.060 - 00:54:10.140

He's just always wearing red underwear underneath the suit.

Speaker C

00:54:10.220 - 00:54:11.628

It's permanently attached to him.

Seth

00:54:11.684 - 00:54:13.420

Yeah, he's Kendall.

Drew

00:54:13.500 - 00:54:14.364

This is my underwear.

Speaker C

00:54:14.412 - 00:54:17.388

He actually has two flaws. Krypton. Krypton. What is it?

Seth

00:54:17.524 - 00:54:18.156

Kryptonite.

Speaker C

00:54:18.188 - 00:54:34.212

Kryptonite. God, I can't even say it. He has two flaws. Kryptonite and the fact that he's permanently in red underwear. Yeah, that again, that's actually his.

Yeah, that's actually his second flaw. How much. This is probably a really stupid observation, but my 3 year old is obsessed. On YouTube, I've been showing him the old Adam West Batman.

Drew

00:54:34.276 - 00:54:34.756

Oh, yeah.

Seth

00:54:34.788 - 00:54:35.764

Because it's my favorite.

Speaker C

00:54:35.812 - 00:54:36.756

He has this floaty toy.

Seth

00:54:36.788 - 00:54:42.164

For those who want to know. I have Cesar Romero's face tattooed on the side of my. My arm as the Joker.

Speaker C

00:54:42.212 - 00:54:52.380

So, yeah, they are really good. Like, they're fun, they're hilarious. And they. They feel like the 70s. Like even though it's 66, like a lot. Like there's disco humor, though.

Seth

00:54:52.760 - 00:55:03.488

Well, that's what I think ended up being the problem with Tim Burton and Joel Schumachers was they tried to update the corniness but didn't lean 100% into it because they still wanted to make it kind of serious.

Speaker C

00:55:03.584 - 00:55:03.904

Yeah.

Seth

00:55:03.952 - 00:55:08.240

And that just ruined it for me. You go back to the 60s. That's where it was just so much fun.

Drew

00:55:08.280 - 00:55:11.904

Have, has she seen the episode yet with like the shark repellent? That's my favorite.

Speaker C

00:55:11.952 - 00:55:12.704

Oh, not yet.

Seth

00:55:12.792 - 00:55:14.260

That's the. That was the movie.

Speaker C

00:55:15.880 - 00:55:17.840

That's a. I haven't seen that one either. I don't think.

Seth

00:55:17.880 - 00:55:20.848

Oh, it's re. I think it might be on Max. It's really good.

Speaker C

00:55:20.904 - 00:55:21.424

Check it out.

Drew

00:55:21.512 - 00:55:31.040

You know, Batman's got all the gadgets and whenever they can't figure out how to use one of his gadgets, they just give him a pod that says whatever. He's trying to stop repellent. There was a time where a shark was jumping at him.

Speaker C

00:55:31.080 - 00:55:31.584

That's amazing.

Drew

00:55:31.632 - 00:55:35.312

Pulled out from his utility belt a jar that just said shark repellent.

Speaker C

00:55:35.376 - 00:55:36.176

That's incredible.

Drew

00:55:36.288 - 00:55:38.112

And now I have to watch it.

Seth

00:55:38.216 - 00:55:42.820

That's where my favorite Batman quote comes from. Some days you can't get rid of a bomb.

Speaker C

00:55:44.280 - 00:55:52.900

Wow, that's amazing. You know, you meet a lot of people who they say to this day, even some younger people I know think Adam west is still the best Batman, so.

Seth

00:55:52.940 - 00:55:59.652

Oh, absolutely. Technically, he's the most comic accurate. He's the right height and weight for standardized comic Batman.

Speaker C

00:55:59.716 - 00:56:00.404

That's pretty crazy.

Seth

00:56:00.452 - 00:56:00.916

Yeah.

Speaker C

00:56:01.028 - 00:56:38.738

But going back to my original point, I was actually working on the production sheet for the show while my son was, you know, I was just like, I need five minutes to work on this. And I was watching it while I was like writing about this and I look over and I'm like noticing like his. His trunks are high waisted.

Yeah, because that was the thing. Every pants were just like. You wore your belt lot. Your belt line was above your belly button back then.

And I'm like, I guess today is it Again, this could be a dumb observation, but to meet today's standards, we don't really do high waisted. I guess it's coming back from women a little bit. They're do some of the 90s, but in general. So is it going to look more like a Speedo now?

Because we don't do high waisted trunks. I mean, so it wouldn't look good.

Seth

00:56:38.794 - 00:56:39.922

No, it doesn't look good.

Drew

00:56:40.026 - 00:57:01.068

It'll be weird, but I think when people see it, hopefully they'll. It'll kind of remind them of like old school Superman. That's more like upbeat and bubbly and fun and not dark.

And so they're using Hope in theory they're using the out the older outdated outfit to remind you of like a simpler Superman. But I think. I think it'll still look stupid. Stupid.

Seth

00:57:01.084 - 00:57:02.828

I mean, in the trailer it looks dumb as hell.

Drew

00:57:02.844 - 00:57:03.084

Yeah.

Speaker C

00:57:03.132 - 00:57:05.180

Yeah. Bring out the super Speedo. That's what I say.

Drew

00:57:05.220 - 00:57:09.800

Yeah. Yeah. He just needs a. The banana hammock is.

Speaker C

00:57:10.100 - 00:57:11.996

Yeah, that's right. Super sausage.

Seth

00:57:12.028 - 00:57:14.392

Just a nice jockstrap. Yeah.

Speaker C

00:57:14.536 - 00:57:15.944

Or a cup. He needs a cup.

Seth

00:57:16.032 - 00:57:20.344

Yeah. Oh, do you want to hear one more fun little rando?

Speaker C

00:57:20.392 - 00:57:20.760

Yes, please.

Drew

00:57:20.800 - 00:57:22.220

I think I know this rando.

Seth

00:57:22.560 - 00:57:26.952

They had to digitally alter the size of Henry Cavill's dick.

Speaker C

00:57:27.016 - 00:57:27.384

Really?

Seth

00:57:27.472 - 00:57:29.880

Because it was so bulgy in the costume.

Speaker C

00:57:29.960 - 00:57:30.200

Really?

Seth

00:57:30.240 - 00:57:32.040

They were just like, yeah, we gotta tone that down.

Speaker C

00:57:32.080 - 00:57:32.840

That's amazing.

Drew

00:57:32.920 - 00:57:47.460

I remember. Here's a rando about that rando. I remember when I learned that fact, it was. Cause I was on the plane.

On a plane with my mom flying somewhere, probably to Colorado at the time. Probably to my grandfather's funeral. If we want to get real dark with this.

Speaker C

00:57:47.500 - 00:57:47.924

Oh, wow.

Drew

00:57:47.972 - 00:57:58.196

And she's like. She's reading it in an article in one of those magazines. So my mother just looks at me. Hey, have you. Have you ever thought of Henry Cavill's dick?

Because you're about to. And she shares that fact with me. And so now I always.

Speaker C

00:57:58.268 - 00:57:58.564

Wow.

Seth

00:57:58.612 - 00:57:58.996

Amazing.

Speaker C

00:57:59.028 - 00:57:59.844

Thanks, mama Drew.

Seth

00:57:59.892 - 00:58:00.520

Yeah.

Speaker C

00:58:01.340 - 00:58:01.972

Damn.

Seth

00:58:02.036 - 00:58:04.196

I guess he and Willem Dafoe have the same problem.

Speaker C

00:58:04.268 - 00:58:08.692

Yeah. Henry Cavill continues to make me feel inadequate. Yeah.

Drew

00:58:08.756 - 00:58:11.924

What if it was like, at times I felt awkward because my dick was so bad.

Speaker C

00:58:12.012 - 00:58:19.100

Yeah. That's actually the 1500 designs. They just couldn't figure out how to. How to harness the power.

Drew

00:58:19.640 - 00:58:22.336

They were like, we don't want to bring light to that.

Speaker C

00:58:22.408 - 00:58:25.260

So I'm never covering him again. I'm sick of his.

Seth

00:58:26.040 - 00:58:27.504

We got three more movies.

Speaker C

00:58:27.552 - 00:58:34.592

Oh, my God. Just tone it down. Which is funny because every time I see an interview with him, he's so lovable. Because he's actually such a nerd.

Seth

00:58:34.656 - 00:58:35.088

Yeah.

Speaker C

00:58:35.184 - 00:58:38.064

Shall we destroy $2 trillion worth of buildings?

Seth

00:58:38.112 - 00:58:38.560

Let's do it.

Drew

00:58:38.600 - 00:58:39.040

Let's do it.

Speaker C

00:58:39.080 - 00:58:40.058

Shall we fly?

Seth

00:58:40.184 - 00:58:40.534

Yeah.

Speaker C

00:58:40.582 - 00:58:41.590

Shall we? Super.

Seth

00:58:41.710 - 00:58:44.454

Shall we make some shaped ships? Yes.

Speaker C

00:58:44.582 - 00:58:58.934

Yes. Let's war. Let's. Let's. Yeah. I was trying to think. Let's Justice. So the categories are if it's positive. This is amazing. If. If you like it. Positive.

Affirmative. Snyder. Barely know her.

Drew

00:58:59.022 - 00:58:59.930

Okay.

Speaker C

00:59:01.070 - 00:59:19.662

And then this is actually Movie wars tradition. This. This predates very immature things that we did in the early rendition. And you're gonna love this Seth Rogen fan. If you don't like it, if you.

If it's bad, super bad. So let's go. Top Bill. Cast Henry Cavill, Amy Adams, Michael Shannon.

Seth

00:59:19.806 - 00:59:32.318

Fuck yeah. They're all perfect in their roles. I do remember there being controversy over Amy Adams not having dark hair like the traditional Lois Lane does.

I think she very much pulled off her own version of Lois.

Drew

00:59:32.414 - 00:59:45.880

I think Amy Adams as an actress was my favorite part of. For both. Both movies. I was like, she stands out more than. Because I feel like she took this. Okay, no offense, Seth. Not as you'll take this offensive.

I just.

Seth

00:59:46.000 - 00:59:46.792

Where are we going with this?

Drew

00:59:46.816 - 01:00:08.070

I don't want you to punch me on Snyder's behalf, but in both movies, and probably in the Justice League movies, when I rewatch them, one of my biggest issues is the dialogue and the lack of. I don't know if it's a lack of acting, but lack of just given to. To act. And Amy Adams, I felt like pulled it off better than anybody else. Huh?

Speaker C

01:00:08.150 - 01:00:08.454

Yeah.

Seth

01:00:08.502 - 01:00:22.230

Yeah. I don't feel that way at all. But I. Okay. But yeah, no, I think she was amazing.

I think Michael Shannon is one of the most terrifying villains I've seen in a superhero movie to date. He rivals Thanos as far as just sheer. Holy shit.

Speaker C

01:00:22.310 - 01:00:22.806

Yeah.

Seth

01:00:22.918 - 01:00:25.846

So, yeah, Snyder barely know her on both of these.

Speaker C

01:00:25.918 - 01:00:27.414

Snyder barely know her.

Drew

01:00:27.502 - 01:00:30.290

Yeah, I'll give. I'll give Snyder barely know her.

Seth

01:00:32.900 - 01:00:33.964

Especially you.

Drew

01:00:34.052 - 01:00:40.140

Especially Henry Cavill and Amy Adams. And all three of them did good, too.

Seth

01:00:40.180 - 01:00:40.892

Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker C

01:00:41.036 - 01:01:19.966

Well, what do you think? I love what Henry Cavill did here. I'll say this. I don't like Superman as a hero. I just.

It doesn't matter what version, but the moments where he was trying to become accessible and giving us the kind of the. We were peeking into the what? The human aspect. I love that. I think he did great.

And actually I've become a fan of him since I love Geralt and I think he's as a person. He seems really interesting and I like what he does here. I had a really hard time. I am gonna go Snyder barely nowhere here.

I love Michael Shannon, but I love. He's done a lot of great independent movies that I love. The. Jeff Nichols, the guy that directed mud with Matthew McConaughey.

Seth

01:01:19.998 - 01:01:20.610

Yeah.

Speaker C

01:01:20.950 - 01:01:23.550

He did a movie called Take, Take Shelter.

Seth

01:01:23.630 - 01:01:24.110

Okay.

Speaker C

01:01:24.190 - 01:01:39.548

Is one of Jessica Chastain's first movies. Nice and great independent movie. And I love him. And it was really hard for me at first to kind of see him in a big budget movie.

Fair Because I had loved him and it took me a minute, but yeah, I eventually really warmed up to what he did here.

Seth

01:01:39.604 - 01:01:40.828

Have you seen Premium Rush?

Speaker C

01:01:40.924 - 01:01:42.892

I have not. Oh, is that a good one?

Seth

01:01:42.916 - 01:01:47.340

That's Joseph Gordon Levitt as a bike courier. And Michael Shannon is a dirty cop.

Speaker C

01:01:47.420 - 01:01:47.756

Really?

Seth

01:01:47.828 - 01:01:53.014

And he's like, he, he's trying to track down something that Joseph Gord Levitt is trying to, to. To. To transport.

Speaker C

01:01:53.062 - 01:01:54.342

It's so interesting.

Seth

01:01:54.406 - 01:01:55.126

Yeah.

Speaker C

01:01:55.318 - 01:01:57.398

Cool. I, I should, I should check that out.

Seth

01:01:57.454 - 01:02:00.342

That was my introduction to Michael Shannon actually, before man of Steel.

Speaker C

01:02:00.406 - 01:02:00.694

Okay.

Seth

01:02:00.742 - 01:02:01.014

Yeah.

Speaker C

01:02:01.062 - 01:02:02.790

That's awesome. He's a great actor. He does.

Seth

01:02:02.830 - 01:02:03.638

Absolutely.

Speaker C

01:02:03.814 - 01:02:19.748

And then I. The only one I had a little trouble with. Amy Adams is actually a top five actress for me. I love her, especially in the David O. Russell films.

I, I think she did. I think she was more serviceable than great here, but still good enough to give it a good mark. So Snyder barely know her.

Seth

01:02:19.814 - 01:02:25.624

I mean, for me, I think it really comes down to. I don't think there's usually much to the character of Lois Lane.

Speaker C

01:02:25.672 - 01:02:25.944

Yeah.

Seth

01:02:25.992 - 01:02:28.904

And I feel like she actually brought some depth to that character.

Speaker C

01:02:28.952 - 01:02:35.512

Yeah, yeah. Usually she's. She, she definitely airs more. Damsel in distress. Whereas here she's real strong. She's like a military journalist.

Seth

01:02:35.576 - 01:02:47.104

She plays both really well because whenever she is in danger, she doesn't. It's only because it's an outrageous level of danger that she's in that it's never like, oh, help me, I'm stuck somewhere.

It's like, no, I'm about to fall off a bill.

Drew

01:02:47.232 - 01:03:07.968

She, she. I feel like the character of Lois Lane is never really a damsel in distress.

She's always like a outspoken reporter trying to get to the bottom of the news, like really brave. But then she finds herself in Quagmires captured by an alien about to be incinerated. There's only so much you can do without your red underwear.

Speaker C

01:03:08.064 - 01:03:38.868

It's true. It's true. You need your red underwear attached to you at all times. All right, one to zero. Here we go. Supporting cast. Russell Crowe as Jor? El.

Diane Lane, Martha Kent. And then I'm going down to people we would know. I love this. Harry Lennox is General Swanwick. That guy's like always.

He's always a hard ass military guy in every movie he's in. Richard Shift is Dr. Emil Hamilton. And then going down the list farther, Kevin Costner as Jonathan Kent. And Laurence Fishburne is Perry White.

Seth

01:03:39.024 - 01:03:43.932

I honestly think this is one of the best supporting casts. Laurence Fishburne was fucking great.

Drew

01:03:44.036 - 01:03:47.436

I would have loved to see more of him. Maybe that was part of the hour and a half that wasn't.

Seth

01:03:47.468 - 01:04:23.478

See, that's where I love him. And bvs, you see so much more of him in bvs and I think he's fantastic. Kevin Costner.

Well, I slightly disagree with some of the decisions that were made about the character by Snyder. I do think Kevin Costner killed that role.

Like trying to be the, the earthly version of Jor El where you're sitting there saying, here's how to be a human. Don't. Don't overdo it. Don't make people scared of who you are.

And then he had the other side of Russell Crowe, who I also thought killed it doing his thing where he's like, no, no, you have to embrace the extraordinary part of yourself. So.

Drew

01:04:23.534 - 01:04:37.008

Which is another.

That was another decision that they made because usually Jonathan and Jerrell are, are forming two different parts of Clark that end up working together. But they were both kind of just encouraging him to be the, to be the hero and whatever.

Seth

01:04:37.104 - 01:04:39.280

Yeah. Snyder barely know her. For me.

Speaker C

01:04:39.320 - 01:04:42.224

All right. It's fun to say, I'll give her.

Drew

01:04:42.232 - 01:05:04.098

A Snyder barely know her. Like I said, I felt like the actors did well. There are times when I did think like the script was a little dry.

Not so much the action watching it, that part was like. And I thought this frequently. Anytime the characters were talking, I was like, I'm a little bored. Like just throughout both these movies.

Seth

01:05:04.194 - 01:05:05.122

Well, we'll get there.

Speaker C

01:05:05.226 - 01:05:11.090

Yeah. So you also went Snyder. Okay. I actually went super bad.

Seth

01:05:11.210 - 01:05:11.762

Interesting.

Speaker C

01:05:11.826 - 01:05:30.684

And it's hard for me because I love Kevin Coner, but I really love Lawrence Fishburn.

I'm not like a giant Russell Crowe fan, but I, I feel like all three of those actors, I got pretty like regular performances here and I just wanted more. The only one to me that over delivered was Diane Lane.

Seth

01:05:30.732 - 01:05:31.660

I thought she was so good.

Speaker C

01:05:31.700 - 01:05:33.372

She. And she gets even better in the next one.

Seth

01:05:33.396 - 01:05:33.836

Oh my God.

Speaker C

01:05:33.868 - 01:05:54.652

Yes, she shows a lot here. But I, considering how great. And I'm very deep on Laurence Fishburne. Like I, I loved him as Larry Fishburne when he was in Apocalypse now. That.

That's how much I love him. He was only like what, 15 in that movie? It's crazy. Yeah. I've seen him in Boys in the Hood and Matrix. Like you, I've just seen so much dynamic.

Even more dynamic here.

Drew

01:05:54.676 - 01:05:55.026

Yeah.

Speaker C

01:05:55.108 - 01:06:01.350

I just don't think, I think. And I don't necessarily blame him, but I do think I do Think there was more that could have been done there.

Seth

01:06:01.390 - 01:06:06.182

I mean, he is kind of the straight like straight edge version of JJJ from the Spider.

Drew

01:06:06.246 - 01:06:06.486

Yeah.

Speaker C

01:06:06.518 - 01:06:06.774

Yeah.

Drew

01:06:06.822 - 01:06:14.262

I am kind of. I do realize I am mixing my interpretation of him with both movies right now with the. Because he is more in Batman vs Superman.

Seth

01:06:14.326 - 01:06:14.902

Yeah.

Drew

01:06:15.046 - 01:06:18.838

And he. What he really wasn't. Didn't. I feel like he.

Seth

01:06:18.974 - 01:06:26.240

I mean, there just wasn't much for him to do story wise. Like, I don't think it's his fault. I think he did the best that he could with how little he was in the movie.

Speaker C

01:06:26.320 - 01:06:26.624

Yeah.

Seth

01:06:26.672 - 01:06:28.992

But I. Yeah, I don't think he did a bad job at all.

Speaker C

01:06:29.096 - 01:06:39.632

Yeah. It's just three fantastic actors that did. Did good jobs. But I kind of want, you know how I am though.

I always want like some of that supporting cast to really like pop. And I just felt like it's pretty. Besides Diane Lane, the rest.

Drew

01:06:39.656 - 01:06:41.856

But there were no villains from the Crow, that's for sure.

Speaker C

01:06:41.928 - 01:06:59.980

I know. Where's Dennis Hopper? Yeah. But you guys both. So it's two to zero. Here we go. Writing and this is a lot of writing going on. David S. Goyer screenplay.

David S. Goyer and Christopher Nolan for the story. It's so weird to say that out loud. Y. And then Jerry Siegel and Joe Shuster for creating Superman.

Seth

01:07:00.060 - 01:07:45.680

So here's the thing that you kind of see with this. This. And I've always said this, but man of Steel. Man of Steel is the least Zack Snyder. Zack Snyder movie. He.

You could definitely see his influence on delivery and cinematography and a lot of. Lot of pieces. But there's almost no slow motion in this movie, which is obviously very much a Snyder signature. I personally love it.

If I'm going to go see a Snyder movie, that's what I expect. Now, as far as the writing is concerned, I. I personally love the story. I understand what you're saying.

There are times where like the dialogue might drag a little bit, but those are also supposed to be like slower moments to really hone in on the human part of the movie. So I'm going to say Snyder. Barely know her. I know I'm probably going to be alone with this, but that's my opinion.

Drew

01:07:46.260 - 01:08:25.192

Yeah. I think this is how I know. I struggle with people pleasing because I know none of these people are gonna hear my vote and it doesn't like.

And no one in the. No one who's listening to the podcast is gonna like turn their car into traffic when I say this. But I still struggle saying it.

I'm Gonna give it a super bad. I, I, I loved the action. I love that. I, I realized when I watched this, I, I, I, I love the characters and the overall story.

But then, like, when I'm actually watching it and the overall story, there were just too many times where I was like, I mean, I guess that's a decision. I felt like I said that a lot.

Seth

01:08:25.376 - 01:08:30.952

Didn't David S. Goyer do Shitty of Angels? Which one? Which, which, which crow did he do?

Speaker C

01:08:30.976 - 01:08:36.424

Oh, Goyer did. No, Goyer did he. I can't remember. There was a big.

Seth

01:08:36.512 - 01:08:38.232

Yeah, there was a two or three that he did.

Speaker C

01:08:38.256 - 01:08:39.192

Oh, a City of Angels.

Seth

01:08:39.256 - 01:08:40.760

Okay. Yeah, yeah. So he did shitty.

Speaker C

01:08:40.840 - 01:08:42.216

That's right. City of Angels. Sorry.

Drew

01:08:42.248 - 01:08:43.336

Well, there we go. That's.

Seth

01:08:43.368 - 01:08:43.672

I've.

Drew

01:08:43.736 - 01:08:51.713

Now I know why I don't like it. I, that was the only. Pretty sure that was the only crow movie that I just actively did not enjoy.

Speaker C

01:08:51.761 - 01:08:52.033

Yeah.

Drew

01:08:52.081 - 01:08:56.001

Reboot. I didn't love, but I could have. I still found a little bit of joy.

Seth

01:08:56.065 - 01:08:56.401

Yeah.

Speaker C

01:08:56.465 - 01:09:14.904

Yeah. I also went super bad here. And the thing is, is that I like the dialogue the most. I like the writing.

Here is the dialogue between Kevin Costner, Diane Lane and Cavill, like those families. That's where the writing actually shines, which is kind of weird because that's not necessarily Snyder's sweet spot.

Seth

01:09:14.952 - 01:09:16.264

Yeah, well, he didn't do any writing.

Speaker C

01:09:16.312 - 01:09:29.688

I know, but just mean, I just mean it as movies in general. Yeah, like, but you're right. That's a good point. But I, what really killed this category for me were the lines that were written for.

I can't even say her name correctly. Faora. Oh.

Drew

01:09:29.864 - 01:09:30.680

Oh, yeah.

Speaker C

01:09:30.760 - 01:09:37.080

The one that's Zod's right hand. Yeah, the shits. She, she says, Give me some examples.

Seth

01:09:37.160 - 01:09:37.672

Let's hear it.

Speaker C

01:09:37.696 - 01:09:45.468

I just, I don't remember it verbatim. I just, I just remember it taking me out of the movie. Like, the thing. Like, every line she had had. I was like, that is cheesy as.

Drew

01:09:45.604 - 01:10:12.684

Like, I don't, I don't mind in movie action movies like this with the cheesy dialogue. Like, for whatever reason, it's, it's, it's, it's like, it's like when you hear certain things in music for a type of song that's supposed to fit.

When I watch, like, superhero action movies, I, you know, I, if, if they ever put an interpretation of Captain Cold in a DC Comics book and he's not doing, like, cold puns the entire time, I would be, I would be annoyed.

Speaker C

01:10:12.732 - 01:10:13.334

Yeah.

Seth

01:10:13.492 - 01:10:14.066

Cold.

Speaker C

01:10:14.178 - 01:10:15.426

You mean Mr. Freeze.

Drew

01:10:15.538 - 01:10:21.154

No, that different villain Captain Cold is in the flash. Mr. Freeze is the one from Batman.

Seth

01:10:21.202 - 01:10:22.866

I'm probably least familiar with the Flash.

Speaker C

01:10:22.898 - 01:10:25.510

And then Sub Zero and then doctor Thaw.

Seth

01:10:26.330 - 01:10:28.274

It's almost like they ran out of ideas.

Drew

01:10:28.402 - 01:10:30.550

And there's the ice cream Pokemon.

Speaker C

01:10:31.450 - 01:10:37.110

Every movie, they're like, all right, who's gonna be really cold in this movie? Who's. Whose superpower is making cold?

Drew

01:10:37.530 - 01:10:46.460

I forgot about our lines. But while I will not say they were good, I will say it was fun watching her just be an archetype. Lieutenant.

Speaker C

01:10:47.040 - 01:11:15.700

Yeah. Yeah. I. I just. I don't know why, but I just, like, evacuated me out of the movie. I was like, all right. Because I.

What sucks is, like, because I'm really into the dynamic between Superman or Kit Clark and his parents. I actually think they nailed that. Yeah. I just. But there was. In the whole last part of the movie, there was just moments.

I'm like, this felt like that they were running out of time with some of this stuff. So anyway, that's. But you. So it's two to one. Okay, cool. Directing, Zack Snyder.

Seth

01:11:16.200 - 01:12:03.834

I mean, I.

Again, he had so many different obstacles directly in front of him as far as beginning a franchise to compete with the Avengers, which already had five movies out, maybe even six by the time this one came out. I don't remember If Iron Man 3 had come out yet. He had that to contend with.

He had the fact that he was drastically changing the tone of a fantastical superhero that people had five movies and the Animated Series and tons of comics that. That hit every different tone. But he had the. The challenge of changing the film tone of Superman, man.

I think he did an incredible job with everything that he was handed. Yeah. I'm gonna give it a Snyder Barely Knower.

Speaker C

01:12:03.882 - 01:12:04.474

Yeah.

Drew

01:12:04.602 - 01:12:05.226

You know what?

Speaker C

01:12:05.298 - 01:12:05.578

If.

Drew

01:12:05.634 - 01:12:13.306

And I. I feel like if he's a category for later movies, I may change my answer, but for this movie alone, I'll give him a Snyder Barely Knower.

Speaker C

01:12:13.338 - 01:12:13.690

Yeah.

Drew

01:12:13.770 - 01:12:15.802

I agree with. I mean, he was starting something fresh.

Seth

01:12:15.866 - 01:12:16.154

Yeah.

Drew

01:12:16.202 - 01:12:27.412

And it really. I mean, I remember seeing it in theaters, and it got us hyped for what was. What was coming up. And, yeah, he.

He took Superman in a different, you know, different light completely.

Seth

01:12:27.476 - 01:12:27.860

Yeah.

Drew

01:12:27.940 - 01:12:40.500

And so I feel like he. I feel like he fell off the thing later. But. But for right now, if we just look at man of Steel. Snyder Barely know her.

Speaker C

01:12:40.540 - 01:13:29.970

Yeah. Zach it up. Zacked it up. I actually also went Snyder barely nowhere here. I actually. One thing I put in my notes was because I.

I went into this thinking about 300. Because you know that what's funny is we've seen enough of him now to know that he. That's not all he does.

Yeah, but that was so signature you and I were talking about in the car on the way over. That was a cultural moment. Yeah, that was like Boondock Saints and somebody. Like, it was like holy. Everyone was talking about 300.

People were seeing it 50 times in theaters. Yeah. And. But that like, it was really easy for me to think like that's gonna be like what he does here. But I.

I saw some of the coloration things like. And it was really reserved for outdoor shots like with.

But I think by and large his ability to kind of tame that here actually worked for the movie because it wasn't distracting and it made me pay more attention to the story. Because with 300 it was just so visually different that I was just like in. So saturated.

Drew

01:13:30.050 - 01:13:30.338

Right.

Speaker C

01:13:30.394 - 01:13:39.170

And Xerxes was just over the. Everything was so over the top. I actually think he tamed some of that here and it worked. So I actually, for that reason, I gave him a Snyder Bailey.

Nowhere here.

Seth

01:13:39.210 - 01:13:39.842

There we go.

Speaker C

01:13:39.946 - 01:13:49.544

Yeah. So look at me. I am capable. It is three to one here. We're getting. We're on. We're on the cusp here. We're on the cusp.

Drew

01:13:49.592 - 01:13:50.664

Dawn of Justice.

Speaker C

01:13:50.792 - 01:13:59.592

Dawn of Justice. Dawn of the red underwear. What's in front of a cinematography, production design, sound, editing, costumes, etc.

Seth

01:13:59.736 - 01:14:44.192

Yeah, I. I have no complaints. I thought the vibe of this movie. Again, keeping in mind culturally what was going on with superhero movies at the time.

What people were literally demanding. And then once BVS hit, we're like, we never wanted that. I'm like, you literally asked for this. But I don't know the.

Other than the tornado, I think the visual effects were off the charts. I think the. The last couple of battle scenes just. Just ripping Metropolis apart was so much fun to watch.

Yeah, I think the set design was really good. I think, I think having a solid dynamic between Smallville and Metropolis. Like, I think he did a really good job there all the way around.

Yeah, I have no complaints. Complaints. So Snyder. Barely know her.

Speaker C

01:14:44.216 - 01:14:46.528

What do you think this is funny every time.

Drew

01:14:46.584 - 01:15:14.566

Yeah, I. I agree. I. Well, and with editing this one, I guess we got the. We got what we got. We got the final product. Like one where it's like.

Well, actually there's a 12 hour one you can watch later if you want. If you want to just call in sick for work tomorrow, you can watch the real version of it. I love to watch it.

Like, look, looking at it, it was aesthetically incredible. We hadn't gotten a lot of the slow motion yet, which. That sometimes distracts me a little bit. I'm like, you want a less than four hour movie?

Speaker C

01:15:14.598 - 01:15:14.806

Yeah.

Drew

01:15:14.838 - 01:15:23.530

Maybe put it at regular time and then. But one thing we hadn't talked about that was also really good was the soundtrack. The. It really fits.

Seth

01:15:23.870 - 01:15:26.854

I'm seeing Hans Zimmer in less than a month and I cannot wait to.

Drew

01:15:26.862 - 01:15:33.670

Hear the stuff and they. They put there was, you know, when he was learning how to fly that. That whole scene.

Speaker C

01:15:33.830 - 01:15:34.570

Yeah.

Drew

01:15:34.920 - 01:15:36.900

So Snyder.

Speaker C

01:15:41.240 - 01:15:43.380

I thought you would think that was funny.

Seth

01:15:44.040 - 01:15:50.980

Begrudgingly. And you're winning by Justice League. I will definitely be like, this is hilarious.

Speaker C

01:15:53.480 - 01:16:15.864

By the way, One thing that you said that reminded me of a thought I had is like one negative thing that came out from just the whole drama with this, with the Snyder cut cuts. Now, people online are always asking for the blank cut of a movie. Have you noticed this? Like, not with like Eggers movies.

No one's like, give me the Edgar cut because he gets his way. But with like big budget movies now we're like, give me the. The blank cut. Whoever directed, I'm like, that's not a thing.

Seth

01:16:15.952 - 01:16:32.120

Well, the only other valid one is David Ayer has a separate cut of Suicide Squad because what happened was they put out that first trailer with Bohemian Rhapsody and then Warner Brothers is like, oh, that did so well. Let's hire that company to re edit the movie.

Speaker C

01:16:32.200 - 01:16:32.552

Yeah.

Seth

01:16:32.616 - 01:16:41.544

Because apparently his version of Suicide Squad, which the day before the movie came out, he tweeted and then deleted his tweet saying, the movie you will see tomorrow is not the movie I made.

Speaker C

01:16:41.632 - 01:16:42.184

Wow.

Seth

01:16:42.312 - 01:17:01.202

And then so basically his tone was vastly closer to man of steel, BVs and Snyder cut. But because they brought in this trailer editing company to re edit and reshoot the movie, it basically just turned into a completely paceless movie.

Speaker C

01:17:01.266 - 01:17:01.730

Yeah.

Seth

01:17:01.810 - 01:17:05.506

Which was nothing but quippy, shitty jokes. It's okay.

Drew

01:17:05.618 - 01:17:08.690

It was your stereotypical jokes. Action.

Seth

01:17:08.810 - 01:17:12.210

Yeah. They were trying to be Guardians of the Galaxy and it was just.

Speaker C

01:17:12.250 - 01:17:13.618

That's not what Suicide Squad is.

Seth

01:17:13.674 - 01:17:22.476

No. And. And if we had. I'm sure one day when. When David Ayer just leaks his cut, I'm sure we'll have a better taste in our mouth after that one. One.

Speaker C

01:17:22.548 - 01:17:22.892

Yeah.

Seth

01:17:22.956 - 01:17:29.148

Yeah. That's the only legitimate one outside of Snyder. It's the only legitimate. Give me the Aer cut.

Drew

01:17:29.204 - 01:17:33.324

I don't know. I think we should get in the habit of releasing the good cuts the first time.

Seth

01:17:33.412 - 01:17:34.540

Yes, I agree.

Drew

01:17:34.660 - 01:17:35.452

Calling it.

Speaker C

01:17:35.556 - 01:17:38.524

Yeah. It sounds like something you would yell at a butcher.

Seth

01:17:38.572 - 01:17:38.892

Yeah.

Speaker C

01:17:38.956 - 01:17:42.860

You know, give me the prime rib, guys. Give me the good.

Seth

01:17:42.980 - 01:17:44.880

Give me the USDA prime.

Drew

01:17:45.700 - 01:18:04.092

I wouldn't be surprised.

I mean, and this does sound a little conspiracy theory, but I wouldn't be surprised if it really is just a marketing tactic where they're like, we're gonna put out a less good, abbreviated version. People are gonna get pissed off and post about it online, which will help people see our stuff.

Seth

01:18:04.156 - 01:18:04.732

Yeah.

Drew

01:18:04.876 - 01:18:13.160

And then a little while later, we're gonna release a different version, get people re excited again, and make twice, if not three times as much.

Speaker C

01:18:13.940 - 01:18:27.940

Because that's what defines great art as being basically persuaded by the online artists. Don't go, oh, okay, I'm listening.

You know, a great artist is like, can you imagine Lars von Trier changing something in his movie because he read a Reddit comment?

Drew

01:18:28.320 - 01:18:35.960

Listen, all I'm saying is, for the first time around, the Fast and Furious people heard put. Put cars in space.

Speaker C

01:18:36.080 - 01:18:36.472

Yeah.

Drew

01:18:36.536 - 01:18:38.776

And they put cars in space by the ninth movie.

Speaker C

01:18:38.808 - 01:18:41.496

So everybody gets there. They put Jason Voorhees in space.

Seth

01:18:41.568 - 01:18:42.248

Yeah.

Speaker C

01:18:42.424 - 01:18:48.850

All right. I wouldn't be surprised if they put, like, the Shining in space or like, it's like, well, we're out of ideas. Says put them in space.

Seth

01:18:51.070 - 01:18:52.182

You didn't give your score.

Speaker C

01:18:52.246 - 01:19:17.970

Oh, yeah. I actually. I went super bad here. Sorry again. There are some things I love, and almost everything I loved about this movie was the family interaction.

I really gravitated towards that because I do think for the first time ever, as someone that's very impartial to Superman, I actually, for the first time, like, oh, wow. Like, I really. I feel like I love the way the outdoor films. I love the cornfields. Like, the farm scenes are really well done.

Seth

01:19:18.010 - 01:19:18.178

Yeah.

Drew

01:19:18.194 - 01:19:24.658

You should totally watch Smallville, the TV show that has 10 seasons. Yeah. I am obsessed. And it is a lot about the.

Speaker C

01:19:24.714 - 01:19:25.586

I'll dive right in.

Seth

01:19:25.658 - 01:19:29.550

But tell me, other than ships and a tornado, what did you not like?

Speaker C

01:19:29.930 - 01:19:34.670

The tornado looked really bad to me. The ships looked really bad to me.

Seth

01:19:35.050 - 01:19:37.458

Outside of those, what did you hate about the visuals?

Speaker C

01:19:37.554 - 01:20:07.954

Oh, well, I really. You. I know you love the fight scenes. I. I did not. I again went. And again, I know this is a Superman problem.

Not necessarily necessarily, but I still have all the material I have experienced with Superman. I don't know the rules.

Like, even tenant, like we talk about that was our big criticism of other people, was they explained the rules in the first 15 minutes. But I just.

Every time I see a big Superman brawl, and that brawl is so extensive, like, yeah, some of the damage is cool, but, like, I still don't understand, like, when he's doing the most damage. Like, what are his limitations?

Drew

01:20:08.002 - 01:20:10.226

Here, Be a nerd and answer that for you, please.

Speaker C

01:20:10.298 - 01:20:13.004

Well, please do, because, again, I don't care about comics.

Drew

01:20:13.162 - 01:20:50.188

So the big thing about Superman is he, with normal humans, with people, everyday physical contact, he had to learn how to barely touch to barely touch. And then one of the.

I don't know if you got to this in the Justice League series yet, but one of the best scenes in the entire Animated Series is you do get to see Darkseid, who was eventually going to be the villain for the Snyderverse. He comes to Earth, and Superman realizes that this guy's just as tough as him. And he has this amazing monologue. You could look online or if you want.

You don't have to. And. And he. And where he's just like, I always feel like I live in a world where everyone's made out of paper. But you're not.

I can finally cut loose on you.

Seth

01:20:50.244 - 01:20:50.524

Yeah.

Drew

01:20:50.572 - 01:21:32.470

And so then he finally just beats the crap out of me. That's how he wins the fight. But the big thing is, is as he's learning to control his powers. On Earth, part of his development was learning how to.

So anytime he's fighting Kryptonian, he can go big, you know, punch, go crazy. Anytime he's finding a monster. But then you see him when he handles the human villains, he learns to tone it back a little bit.

Something that's kind of funny since I referenced Smallville. When it's all about him growing into Superman, it's all about him growing into his high school years.

When he has his first girlfriend, he's afraid to have sex with her because he doesn't know if he can. When he climaxes, if he can control his power. And then a couple seasons later, he starts dating her again.

Speaker C

01:21:32.510 - 01:21:33.718

Yeah. Super sperm. Yeah.

Drew

01:21:33.734 - 01:21:46.198

She's wondering. They're talking about it, and she's like, isn't that an issue?

And then he said, like, there was a part where, like, he went on to, like, into the Fortress of Solitude and learned a bunch of Kryptonian stuff. And he's like, part of my education was I learned how to control myself.

Speaker C

01:21:46.294 - 01:21:47.558

So dirty.

Seth

01:21:47.734 - 01:22:00.000

Oh, my God.

There's a moment in How I Met yout Mother where they find out Barney takes performance enhancing pills for sex, and he gives them to Marshall, and he goes, just be careful. When you finish it has a kickback, like a cannon.

Speaker C

01:22:00.080 - 01:22:01.072

Oh my God.

Seth

01:22:01.216 - 01:22:02.432

That's what that reminds me of.

Speaker C

01:22:02.456 - 01:22:02.944

Oh, my God.

Drew

01:22:02.992 - 01:22:09.440

So there's your. I don't, I don't want to say it's a good answer to the issue you have, but it is an answer.

Speaker C

01:22:09.520 - 01:22:24.752

Well, first of all, I think which Jay and Silent Bob. There's the Jay inside the Bob movie where they have a whole conversation about. About Superman climaxing and like.

Yeah, like blower blow right out the back or something. They say something like that. I think it might be mall rats.

Seth

01:22:24.896 - 01:22:27.610

Probably what inspired the Smallville storyline.

Speaker C

01:22:28.510 - 01:22:48.406

That is so cool. And if that was in the movie, actually it would have like elevated it for me. Because here's the thing. Does it look cool? Kind of like.

It's not that I haven't seen a scene as cool or less cool. Like it's pretty on par for action. But I don't know how much damage he's doing. I don't know how much damage Zod is. I. This is like who's winning?

Seth

01:22:48.438 - 01:22:49.494

Because they're equally matched.

Drew

01:22:49.542 - 01:22:49.814

Yeah.

Seth

01:22:49.862 - 01:22:50.774

That's the whole point.

Speaker C

01:22:50.862 - 01:22:58.052

But I don't feel like I have that understanding. Like, I just don't. Like, I don't feel like they've done a good job telling me the level of power.

Seth

01:22:58.236 - 01:23:09.652

See, here's where I. I think it all really does come to a head. And maybe this will change your opinion, maybe it won't. Clearly they're equally matched.

And Clark doesn't want to kill him.

Speaker C

01:23:09.756 - 01:23:10.084

Yeah.

Seth

01:23:10.132 - 01:23:17.348

And that's when Zod has that moment where he just like, oh, no, no, no, no, no. If you're gonna beat me, you are going to kill me.

Speaker C

01:23:17.404 - 01:23:17.636

Yeah.

Seth

01:23:17.668 - 01:23:19.524

That's the only way this ends.

Speaker C

01:23:19.572 - 01:23:19.940

Yeah.

Seth

01:23:20.020 - 01:23:31.418

And so that's where I think that whole fight, Superman is pulling back. And that's why it might be a little hard to understand what his rules are is because he doesn't even know what his rules are.

Speaker C

01:23:31.474 - 01:23:31.754

Yeah.

Seth

01:23:31.802 - 01:23:39.306

He's not trying to kill Zod. And so he's only trying to put him down. He's not trying to absolutely destroy him.

Speaker C

01:23:39.378 - 01:23:39.722

Yeah.

Seth

01:23:39.786 - 01:24:01.686

And so it's in that moment where he genuinely finds out. No, this is, this isn't even my limit. When I kill. When he breaks Sod's neck, he's just finding out the beginning of where he can truly go.

And so I, I understand where your complaint comes from, but I think it all comes from being a full out origin movie of Superman.

Speaker C

01:24:01.718 - 01:24:02.150

Okay.

Drew

01:24:02.230 - 01:24:24.990

I also think the them being evenly matched, it gets us to the End of the fight, which it wasn't solved by one physically besting another. It was solved. You had Zod, who had nothing to lose and nothing to live for and just wanted to just. I'm either gonna die or I'm gonna kill you.

But even. Even if you were gonna kill, he had, like, that. He was done. He was already defeated, kind of. He was just.

Seth

01:24:25.030 - 01:24:25.534

Yeah.

Drew

01:24:25.662 - 01:24:33.198

And then. So that the ending of the fight wasn't really a win for Superman either, because he had to choose to finally, like.

Speaker C

01:24:33.254 - 01:24:33.950

Yeah, he got.

Drew

01:24:33.990 - 01:24:42.758

They got himself in a lot where Zod was like, I'm gonna either kill these people or you're gonna have to kill me. Because at this point, he was done. He was. He was not in a good place emotionally.

Speaker C

01:24:42.894 - 01:24:47.926

I need a Mortal Kombat Health meters. And so, yeah, fatality. Like, if that. That would have helped me.

Seth

01:24:47.998 - 01:24:49.814

So I think they were both at halfway.

Drew

01:24:49.862 - 01:24:50.038

Yeah.

Speaker C

01:24:50.054 - 01:24:50.470

Okay.

Drew

01:24:50.550 - 01:25:00.342

So that was when he snapped his neck. I think that the reason they were that they made them to look evenly matched so that that last scene could be so impactful.

Speaker C

01:25:00.406 - 01:25:01.830

Yeah. Okay.

Drew

01:25:01.910 - 01:25:04.198

But I could also. I also see where you're saying, though, where.

Speaker C

01:25:04.254 - 01:25:04.566

Yeah.

Drew

01:25:04.598 - 01:25:05.558

It doesn't look like there's any.

Speaker C

01:25:05.614 - 01:25:21.756

I just want to know who's like. Because, you know, that's. That's a great fight.

Like, there's always a great moment, and, like, it's cliche, but, like, the guy who's going to win, the hero we want to win, is down and out and bloodied. But here with Superman, it's like. Well, I don't know who's, like, more damaged right now. Maybe it's because I am thinking about it like a video game.

Drew

01:25:21.828 - 01:25:39.308

You want to get nitpicky, too? How is a farm boy from Kansas standing toe to toe with, like, the military leader who's got, like, all this tactics and training?

Like, what did Superman have that led him to prepare for that, except for maybe the fact that he had more control over his powers in that moment?

Seth

01:25:39.404 - 01:25:48.136

There's that. But so 1v1. Like, none of that strategy comes into play. It literally is just, who's gonna beat the. Out of the other. Better.

Speaker C

01:25:48.288 - 01:25:48.760

Yeah.

Seth

01:25:48.840 - 01:25:56.260

So I. I think even if you were just like, a drunk brawler and had those powers, you would. You would be able to fight someone pretty well.

Speaker C

01:25:56.640 - 01:25:57.240

Yeah.

Drew

01:25:57.320 - 01:26:04.728

I don't know. I. Whenever I get superpowers, and if I figure out, like, a MMA fighter also has superpowers, I'm still gonna steer clear from them.

Speaker C

01:26:04.864 - 01:26:15.222

Maybe I'm just. I'm too trivial because, like, I think about, like, what kind of superpower I'd have is like, as long as I don't ever have to drive again.

Yeah, I would be happy. So what is that superpower like you.

Drew

01:26:15.246 - 01:26:17.078

I can teleportation fine.

Speaker C

01:26:17.174 - 01:26:20.534

I can afford a butler. Yeah, that's my superpower.

Drew

01:26:20.582 - 01:26:20.902

Yeah.

Speaker C

01:26:20.966 - 01:26:24.198

I just never, like. So I'm just not cut out for this world.

Drew

01:26:24.254 - 01:26:27.062

There's also an Uber app that would be great for your if it was.

Speaker C

01:26:27.086 - 01:26:38.642

Free all the time. How about an Uber app without surge pricing? Yeah, that's my superpower. Just a discount. That's all I want. Yeah, it is four to one here.

We are loving this.

Seth

01:26:38.746 - 01:26:42.050

Yeah, we are loving this. We're barely knowing this.

Speaker C

01:26:42.170 - 01:26:43.550

Barely knowing this.

Seth

01:26:45.850 - 01:26:46.802

What are your categories?

Speaker C

01:26:46.866 - 01:26:50.070

This really works here. How good are these bad guys? Eh.

Seth

01:26:50.490 - 01:26:51.218

I love them.

Speaker C

01:26:51.274 - 01:26:51.650

Yeah.

Seth

01:26:51.730 - 01:27:03.362

I mean, obviously Michael Shannon kicks it out of the park with. With his performance, but I know your complaint is with the woman, which is very sexist of you. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

That's your only complaint is with the.

Speaker C

01:27:03.386 - 01:27:04.886

One said Amy Adams.

Drew

01:27:04.978 - 01:27:05.374

Badass.

Speaker C

01:27:05.422 - 01:27:05.998

And I love her.

Seth

01:27:06.054 - 01:27:07.886

Yeah, but we know you're a sexist piece of.

Speaker C

01:27:07.958 - 01:27:08.414

I know.

Seth

01:27:08.502 - 01:27:10.478

Besides being the only one of us that's married.

Drew

01:27:10.654 - 01:27:15.294

Yeah, but don't you know that's how you get women and they're carnally.

Speaker C

01:27:15.422 - 01:27:17.838

Well, I married my maid, so there we go.

Drew

01:27:17.974 - 01:27:18.830

There we go.

Seth

01:27:18.950 - 01:27:39.582

You better keep that in and show it to her. But I don't know. I. I like them. I. I like the way that. That they're.

They're all interacting, especially when they all come out and get him and get Lois before we even get to. To see him interact with Zod. I think they did a good job. I enjoyed them. So I'm gonna give it a Snyder barely knower.

Speaker C

01:27:39.646 - 01:27:40.526

Yeah, yeah.

Drew

01:27:40.558 - 01:27:56.222

No, Zod is a fantastic villain for Superman. And if they. They were already wanting to be different, so choosing Lex Luthor as the first villain probably wasn't even on the table.

They probably wanted to keep that. And so if you're not gonna do Lex, there are a lot of other options. But, like, Zod's probably a good.

Speaker C

01:27:56.326 - 01:27:57.982

Yeah, that's what they did with Ra's al Ghul.

Drew

01:27:58.046 - 01:27:59.230

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker C

01:27:59.390 - 01:28:00.222

Villains. Yeah.

Drew

01:28:00.286 - 01:28:05.678

So I'm. I. He was good. He was. Is a good villain. So Snyder rarely know her on that one.

Speaker C

01:28:05.734 - 01:28:11.374

Yeah, yeah. I go. I go. Snyder barely know her because of Michael Shannon.

Seth

01:28:11.422 - 01:28:11.982

Yeah.

Speaker C

01:28:12.126 - 01:28:23.918

And I stopped there. I almost because of. Oh, whatever. I cannot fiora all. But I. I don't want to give it too much credit, though.

Outside of Shannon, I'm really not digging these. I'm not digging any of these.

Seth

01:28:23.974 - 01:28:25.038

So you're like a squeak by.

Drew

01:28:25.094 - 01:28:28.494

You're like a 5.1 squeak by literally barely knowing.

Speaker C

01:28:28.542 - 01:28:30.788

And so. Yeah, little. I barely. Barely.

Seth

01:28:30.884 - 01:28:31.796

Just the tip.

Speaker C

01:28:31.908 - 01:28:35.000

Just. Just the tip of the iceberg.

Drew

01:28:35.500 - 01:28:35.876

Yeah.

Seth

01:28:35.908 - 01:28:37.156

That's what we're. Tip the tip.

Speaker C

01:28:37.188 - 01:28:47.620

Yeah. But he's so good. And Michael Shannon, to me, and maybe there's a little bit bias in here because I just love him as an actor anyway. And I kind.

He's one of those guys. I'm just like, I love watching him work, but.

Seth

01:28:47.660 - 01:28:48.916

But he also did a great job.

Speaker C

01:28:48.988 - 01:29:06.986

Yeah, he did. And I think this was out of. This was honestly out of his. His range. Usually. Like, he's never done something this. This outlandish, this forward.

He's usually kind of a low key. Every man. You know, he did Iceman, but even that, he was still kind of calm, cool, and collected. Yeah, I. I really thought he took a big jump here.

Seth

01:29:07.058 - 01:29:07.514

Absolutely.

Speaker C

01:29:07.562 - 01:29:08.490

Yeah. And did a great job.

Seth

01:29:08.530 - 01:29:26.452

This role impacted him so much, he almost didn't come back for Flash because A, he thought he did what he needed to do in the first movie, and B, was kind of felt like it would be a little disrespectful to Zack Snyder. He literally went to Zack Snyder, writer, and asked him for permission to reprise the character in the Flash, and Zach was like, go for it.

Speaker C

01:29:26.476 - 01:29:27.044

That's awesome.

Seth

01:29:27.092 - 01:29:32.692

Yeah. So he. He clearly respected the character to the point that he put everything in it.

Speaker C

01:29:32.796 - 01:29:49.588

Yeah. If you haven't seen Take Shelter out there, I totally recommend Michael Shannon takes you and all of Jeff Nichols movies.

He's from where I'm from Arkansas. His brother is the lead singer of Lazar. What is it? What's the band? Lazar. Not Lizar Lizzo. Lizzo. His brother is the lead singer of Lizzo Lucero.

Drew

01:29:49.684 - 01:29:50.388

Oh, yeah, sorry.

Speaker C

01:29:50.404 - 01:30:12.650

His brother? Yes, his brother. His. Yeah. Yeah. You were close. Yeah, yeah. But yeah, Lucero is the band.

They are very good and he does a lot of the music for his brother's movies. But Mud with Matthew, that was a great movie. Jeff Nichols is a very. Yeah. Anyway, this is. We're not talking about that right now. Well, at six to one.

Can we get another negative in the column? God, I hope so.

Seth

01:30:12.690 - 01:30:13.590

6 to 1.

Speaker C

01:30:14.530 - 01:30:27.910

Sorry. 5 to 1. 5 to 1. I also can't do bad. Lucero the Lucero the Lizzo. Yeah, that was hilarious. Good lore is what this category is called. Categories.

Seth

01:30:28.330 - 01:30:29.058

I like that.

Speaker C

01:30:29.114 - 01:30:58.492

Good lore. I hope you like the Scorecard because we got to stick with it for four episodes.

But just kind of explaining this one, you know, you stacking up and you got interpretations of the comics. You got all these other films. How does this stand? Like, I.

I know I said at the beginning, I'm not coming in this with comic knowledge, but obviously, you know, you. You can't help but judge it by that. How does this just stack? Rake in the lore of just Superman movies. Interpretations like that. You start.

Seth

01:30:58.516 - 01:31:01.932

Because I. I probably know about as much as you do, other than I've seen the animated series.

Drew

01:31:02.036 - 01:31:22.582

I'm. I'm gonna give it. I'm gonna give it a. Snyder barely knew her because I feel like it did stack pretty well with. In the.

The creative liberties he took were very small and inconsequential and nothing like, like completely like. Like, for example, you know, when we talk the next movie we're gonna have to address Doomsday. And like, I don't. That. That was the equivalent.

Speaker C

01:31:22.646 - 01:31:23.462

The turd with teeth.

Drew

01:31:23.526 - 01:31:56.714

Yeah, that was the equivalent to Deadpool and Wolverine with Ryan Reynolds. Like, that was the deep. They were like, well, let's try to do everything Marvel really, you know, including mess up of him.

But in this one, I mean, there were very small things that were like, you know, never been done before. We talked about earlier how he was like, you know, this is the first baby that was made of natural that.

That I don't think came from anything lore wise. But when it comes to the overall story, when it comes to villains, it comes to Superman, I feel like it stuck pretty clear it. He.

He gets a little bit more wild in later movies.

Speaker C

01:31:56.842 - 01:31:57.178

This.

Drew

01:31:57.234 - 01:31:58.298

This one, he's good.

Seth

01:31:58.354 - 01:33:03.698

He definitely picked the. And. And for people who say they don't exist, they definitely exist.

He picked the darker tone Superman movies or comics as his kind of tone inspiration for these. And again, this is coming from someone who barely knows the comics. Way more versed in the movie side of these things, but forgetting the comic lore.

I love how detailed his own lore gets within all three of the movies as we're gonna see as we keep going. I think he.

I'm not sure if the whole first time that, you know, they've procreated in how many thousands of years is a comic accurate thing, but yeah, it feels like it's something that he might have pulled from one random version of the comic that he really liked. It was like, oh, that's a cool detail. We'll throw that in there usually.

And I mean, looking at watchmen and even 300 which is based on a graphic novel. He tends to pull some very hardcore things from the comics that a lot of people probably wouldn't have touched on in. In the casual read. Read.

So I give it a Snyder barely an hour.

Drew

01:33:03.754 - 01:33:14.642

I think it will be interesting as we go on. I. I think my problem will be not that it's like, not comic. Completely comic accurate.

My problem will be that, like, why did you combine these seven comics to create this?

Seth

01:33:14.746 - 01:33:15.202

Sure.

Drew

01:33:15.306 - 01:33:16.994

Or whatever. But. Yeah.

Speaker C

01:33:17.122 - 01:33:18.482

Yeah. What did you give it?

Drew

01:33:18.586 - 01:33:22.306

I gave her a Snide. I gave her. I gave her a Snyder Barely Knower.

Speaker C

01:33:22.338 - 01:33:27.522

Gave her a. Yeah. I. I actually gave it a Snyder Barely Knower too.

Seth

01:33:27.546 - 01:33:28.366

There we go.

Speaker C

01:33:28.538 - 01:33:40.118

Here's the reason I. So I think this is actually a cool category because I don't know the comic. So for me, the. The.

The way to rate this category is does it make me interested in the. The material? The IP More?

Seth

01:33:40.174 - 01:33:40.790

Yeah.

Speaker C

01:33:40.950 - 01:33:49.286

Yes. You know, and that's not to say I could go out and get. I've seen all the movies that have been made, but, you know, I haven't read hardly.

I've probably read two comics. And that was probably when I was seven.

Seth

01:33:49.358 - 01:33:49.990

Yeah.

Speaker C

01:33:50.150 - 01:34:01.498

But if. If I was just looking at this movie standalone, does it say, hey, I would like to know more about Superman? Would you like to know more? More? Yes.

It actually, I. Actually this. This interpretation is more interesting to me.

Seth

01:34:01.554 - 01:34:01.866

Yeah.

Speaker C

01:34:01.898 - 01:34:07.786

And it makes me kind of want to go out and find more source material like it. Yeah. So to me, that's why I would give it a positive.

Seth

01:34:07.898 - 01:34:08.426

Yeah.

Speaker C

01:34:08.538 - 01:34:15.710

So six to one it was a steal. Oh. Man of Steel.

Drew

01:34:17.810 - 01:34:20.394

How many unsubscribes did you just get from that?

Seth

01:34:20.482 - 01:34:21.786

Oh, probably at least 20.

Speaker C

01:34:21.858 - 01:34:27.572

Yeah. A good. A good chunk. Sorry. Probably some at the Snyder. Barely know her too.

Drew

01:34:27.596 - 01:34:28.200

Yeah.

Speaker C

01:34:29.020 - 01:34:44.212

Actually, our old fans will love that. That was a. That was Droop 1.0. That was like his signature. But. Well, this was fun. We are going to continue doing the Snyder trilogy.

We got Batman vs Superman, dawn of Justice coming up. Thank you for hanging out with us. Don't fly too hard. This is Kyle.

Seth

01:34:44.276 - 01:34:44.884

I'm Seth.

Drew

01:34:44.932 - 01:34:45.700

And I'm Drew.

Speaker C

01:34:45.780 - 01:34:46.680

Love y'all.

Drew

01:34:47.020 - 01:34:47.960

See ya.

Seth

01:34:49.660 - 01:34:51.540

Movie Wars SA.